I'm operating on short sleep here, so this may be silly, but you never
know......

Since the rules say we must be chapter members, but more and more people
don't live close to even the minimum 6 people needed to become a chapter,
why not create a "virtual" chapter solely for far-flung folks? They could
"meet" on-line, if they so desired. They could even hold an annual meeting
at a CC (what a concept!). My point is that we might be able to meet both
the letter and the spirit of the rule, while trying to find other solutions.

Elaine

>From: "Ken Warren" <kenw@voicenet.com>
>Reply-To: ICG-D@egroups.com
>To: <ICG-D@egroups.com>
>Subject: RE: [ICG-D] Independent members
>Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 10:44:03 -0400
>
> > The
> > chapters were the dog; the ICG was its tail.
>
>I think we've been seeing this in action for some time, as a matter of
>fact.
>Some of the problems with getting articles for the Quarterly and Annual
>fall
>into this area, I believe, as do problems with getting membership updates
>from chapters. The structure of the ICG gives us no real "teeth" to put
>behind any requirement we may impose on a chapter.
>
> > Maybe that doesn't work anymore. However, this year's annual
> > meeting defeated a motion to separate ICG membership from
> > chapter membership. The members defeated the motion for
> > miuch the same reasons they had been linked ten years ago -- a
> > belief that separation would destroy the local chapters. Instead,
> > they extended the life of a special committee on ICG membership
> > and charged it to consider other options.
>
>As I said elsewhere, the committee opted at that time to adopt a "wait and
>see" attitude, to see if the issues that prompted the original motion would
>correct themselves. We're still "waiting and seeing." :-)
>
> > Right now, the ICG has no restriction that would limit membership
> > in a chapter to one that is close by.
>
>True, but here's the counter-argument that I've been seeing:
>
>I live in West Podunk, Texas, 4+ hours from the closest ICG member, and 6+
>hours from the center of activity of the closest chapter. I have a choice
>of
>joining a number of chapters of the ICG, all of which will charge me money
>to receive a newsletter filled with interesting events that I can't attend.
>(In other words, the newsletter is useful only for it's entertainment
>value,
>not the information it contains.) I will also have no say in anything the
>chapter might do. (No ICG chapter I know of allows mail-in or phone voting
>on matters brought before the chapter at a business meeting. Some chapters
>allow voting by proxy, I believe, but I don't know, for example, if the
>Sick
>Pups do.)
>
>Why, then, should I pay good money for something from which I receive no
>benefit other than to be allowed to pay *more* money for what I really
>wanted, ICG membership?
>
>I think this is the essence of Lisa and Nova's argument.
>
>Ken Warren
>

_________________________________________________________________________
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Hi

As treasurer of the Sick Pups I thought I would finally pipe up. We have
been allowing
people to join up in anyway they please based on their personal feelings on
what sort
of membership they wished for. If someone wanted to JUST join the ICG and
skip local
chapter membership I, and I think the rest of the Pups would be fine with
that. I think the SLUTS offer a similar range of choices and maybe other
guilds too.

Costuming takes up enough time and energy and passion. Membership in the
guild should be easy!

By the way our fee options are currently as follows:

$1 ICG membership (per individual)
$8 Quarterly payments (this will go up if the ICG changes the
amount)
$11 local guild dues for meeting announcements and Puppy Puddles

I don't think we decided on a dollar price on just calling yourself
a Sick Pup but you can certainly earn your way into the guild by winning
the Spaz three times. Just ask Darren Bost (current recording secretary)
how. You could even become and officer of our guild as our current
president, Pierre, knows all too well.

One serious comment on the "Quarterly". Its main purpose is communication
between guilds. Having smaller, more cheaply printed newsletters 3-4 times
a year with on large Annual containing how too information might be a way to
compromise the various problems we are currently incountering. I am also
concerned about people collecting money that they say will be paid to the
ICG for membership but said money is never paid to the ICG. Thats fraud in
the legal sense of the word.

A well back to work

Susan Toker (sue.toker@baesystems.com)

I just checked with Bruce on this so that I didn't inadvertantly put my foot in the doo-doo. The SLUT membership set-up is:

Single membership $12
Family membership (2 people) $16
Additional memberships to family $4 each

That includes the ICG membership and all the lovely add-ons we provide--including the coveted SLUT button and orientation packet.

Honorary memberships (basically to cover cost of newsletter mailing) are $5 each. This does NOT include ICG membership. We do include the button and orientation packet, though.

Our assumption on the honorary situation was that most people who join us already belonged to a chapter.

Jeff Morris
you know the rest

In a message dated 10/11/2000 10:07:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
ecmami@hotmail.com writes:

<< Since the rules say we must be chapter members, but more and more people
don't live close to even the minimum 6 people needed to become a chapter,
why not create a "virtual" chapter solely for far-flung folks? They could
"meet" on-line, if they so desired. They could even hold an annual meeting
at a CC (what a concept!). My point is that we might be able to meet both
the letter and the spirit of the rule, while trying to find other solutions.

>>

Jeff and I had been kicking around an idea a lot like this one. There is a
LOT that could be done with this. Call it the 'cyber chapter' or something
along those lines. Contact can be maintained through mailing lists, message
boards, and/or things like IRC chat. I do something like this with a fanfic
writer's mailing list I own. There's the list, I maintain an IRC chat, and
also there are things like IM. We have an annual 'family picnic' hosted by a
member where those who can make it can meet face to face. This WORKS. I have
made many close friends with a common interest, some of whom I have never met.
There could even be a print newsletter if someone was willing to take it on,
or an associated web page. There is enormous potential in this idea.
However, just because it would be 'virtual' doesn't mean that the usual
caveats don't apply. You still need someone with good qualifications to run
the thing. If it's going to be done on-line, you need someone patient to walk
people who are new to the on-line experience through things and help them
out. Dues would be up to the group. Some mailing lists and IRC chats do
require a fee to maintain. (I pay roughly $10/month for my IRC room, but
there are free services out there)
I think this is definitely an idea that needs to be considered...

Mary

A year ago, Mike Bruno proposed creating an "electronic
chapter." Before he went ahead to prepare a request for
recognition of such a chapter, I asked the Board of Directors to
state their views. At that time, most Board members disliked the
idea. They saw it as no different from any discussion list --
including this one -- and providing no real benefit to its "members."
They also pointed out that the number of members of such a
chapter could easily be manipulated without the rest of the ICG
being any the wiser.

I do not recall how either the Pups or the Sluts responded at the
time. I'd have to check my back files to do so. Maybe Sharon
and Bruce recall . . . .

Byron

>>> marymorris@aol.com 10/11/00 01:03PM >>>

In a message dated 10/11/2000 10:07:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
ecmami@hotmail.com writes:

<< Since the rules say we must be chapter members, but more and more people
don't live close to even the minimum 6 people needed to become a chapter,
why not create a "virtual" chapter solely for far-flung folks? They could
"meet" on-line, if they so desired. They could even hold an annual meeting
at a CC (what a concept!). My point is that we might be able to meet both
the letter and the spirit of the rule, while trying to find other solutions.

>>

Jeff and I had been kicking around an idea a lot like this one. There is a
LOT that could be done with this. Call it the 'cyber chapter' or something
along those lines. Contact can be maintained through mailing lists, message
boards, and/or things like IRC chat. I do something like this with a fanfic
writer's mailing list I own. There's the list, I maintain an IRC chat, and
also there are things like IM. We have an annual 'family picnic' hosted by a
member where those who can make it can meet face to face. This WORKS. I have
made many close friends with a common interest, some of whom I have never met.
There could even be a print newsletter if someone was willing to take it on,
or an associated web page. There is enormous potential in this idea.
However, just because it would be 'virtual' doesn't mean that the usual
caveats don't apply. You still need someone with good qualifications to run
the thing. If it's going to be done on-line, you need someone patient to walk
people who are new to the on-line experience through things and help them
out. Dues would be up to the group. Some mailing lists and IRC chats do
require a fee to maintain. (I pay roughly $10/month for my IRC room, but
there are free services out there)
I think this is definitely an idea that needs to be considered...

Mary


To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com

--- In ICG-D@egroups.com, "Ken Warren" <kenw@v...> wrote:

> True, but here's the counter-argument that I've been seeing:
>
> I live in West Podunk, Texas, 4+ hours from the closest ICG member,

and 6+

> hours from the center of activity of the closest chapter. I have a

choice of

> joining a number of chapters of the ICG, all of which will charge

me money

> to receive a newsletter filled with interesting events that I can't

attend.

> (In other words, the newsletter is useful only for it's

entertainment value,

> not the information it contains.) I will also have no say in

anything the

> chapter might do. (No ICG chapter I know of allows mail-in or phone

voting

> on matters brought before the chapter at a business meeting. Some

chapters

> allow voting by proxy, I believe, but I don't know, for example, if

the Sick

> Pups do.)

Forgive me for patting myself on the back, but I'd have to disagree
with this argument, insofar as the SLUTS are concerned.

In addition to keeping up with our members--wherever they may be,
such as Australia--and what they're doing, reviewing masquerades at
local conventions (and some not so local conventions), we've had a
number of informative articles on estate sales, Halloween costume
contests, and stuff I can't recall at the moment (I tend to go brain
dead upon completing a newsletter). We've had opinion columns on
whether costuming is dead. One member talked about her job, which is
working at a retail fabric store. When all else fails, I'll write
about my experiences in the costuming community. We're going to do
some neat stuff next year, none of which I'm telling you about
because if I do, sure as shooting the articles won't get written
(grin).

So if nothing else, joining the SLUTS provides you with more than
entertainment value, though in my admittedly biased opinion that
alone ought to get you to join. :)

Jeff Morris
Who Should Be Working, But What the Heck...

In a message dated 10/11/2000 2:03:21 PM Central Daylight Time,
bconnell@MAIL.NYSED.GOV writes:

<< A year ago, Mike Bruno proposed creating an "electronic
chapter." Before he went ahead to prepare a request for
recognition of such a chapter, I asked the Board of Directors to
state their views. At that time, most Board members disliked the
idea. They saw it as no different from any discussion list --
including this one -- and providing no real benefit to its "members."
They also pointed out that the number of members of such a
chapter could easily be manipulated without the rest of the ICG
being any the wiser.>>


I don't see the point here. As as been seen recently in this very forum,
there is a strong call from members who for various reasons cannot
participate in chapter activities for some way to 'belong' without having to
join a local chapter that they cannot actively participate in and whose news
is of little interest to them. We are not providing these members (and
potential members, for many chapter members can tell you tales of people who
have refused to join because they can't participate) with very much value for
their money as it stands. The establishment of an 'online chapter' with a
mailing list, a chat room, and an associated web site/newsletter - and, of
course, the CQ - would be an outreach to these people. We are LOSING
potential members over this.

There is also the point to be made that such an on-line chapter would be much
more 'handicapped accessible' for those members/potential members with
physical disabilities. (What obligations do we have with our Incorporation
status, to be accessible? I honestly don't know, but it might be a point to
consider.)

No, it's not quite the same as a 'physical' chapter with face-to-face
meetings. But the potential membership population is one that already cannot
take advantage of that.

As for manipulation of membership numbers - it's not any different from the
situation that exists with the chapters. Really, it's not. Those numbers
could be manipulated just as easily. (And I can think of several ways it
could be done).

I DO believe that a well thought out and drafted 'virtual chapter' concept
could be made to work. I'm NOT suggesting something thrown together hastily.
It would have to be considered how members could qualify for, what particular
benefits should be offered, how things would be arranged. I'm not talking
about 'just' a discussion list, but much more. I am not familiar with the
details of Mike's proposal. Maybe it was not the 'right time' for such a
proposal a year ago, or it was not well thought out. Just because an idea
doesn't work at one point does not mean that it should never be considered
again. Times and situations change, and it has become obvious that such has
happened here.

This is something that could both bring in new memberships and new blood and
help us retain members we might otherwise lose.

MVM

<>

I didn't say an on-line chapter isn't appropriate or desirable now.
In fact, I had no problems with it when Mike proposed one.
Perhaps those who spoke against it then can articulate their
concerns better than I can.

Just because most Board members opposed such a chapter a
year ago doen't mean that the majority of the Board would do so
today. However, in contrast to the 75 or so ICG members who
participate in this discussion list, there <appear> to be large
numbers who distrust electronic communication, computers, and
so forth. This Corporation is a democratic organization. The
Board makes day-to-day decisions by majority vote. At the Annual
Meeting, decisions are made by majority vote (including proxies
where needed). Those decisions may not represent my personal
views or positions, but as President, I have to administer them.

In general, I believe that the best decisions are made by persons
who are informed about exisiting conditions. That's why I
reminded members about the requirements of the bylaws and why
they were written as they are, as well as the recent opposition to
proposals for electonic publishing and electronic chapters. I'm a
historian by training and a believer in the adage, "Those who are
ignorant of the past are doomed to repeat it."

Byron

>>> marymorris@aol.com 10/11/00 04:30PM >>>

In a message dated 10/11/2000 2:03:21 PM Central Daylight Time,
bconnell@MAIL.NYSED.GOV writes:

<< A year ago, Mike Bruno proposed creating an "electronic
chapter." Before he went ahead to prepare a request for
recognition of such a chapter, I asked the Board of Directors to
state their views. At that time, most Board members disliked the
idea. They saw it as no different from any discussion list --
including this one -- and providing no real benefit to its "members."
They also pointed out that the number of members of such a
chapter could easily be manipulated without the rest of the ICG
being any the wiser.>>


I don't see the point here. As as been seen recently in this very forum,
there is a strong call from members who for various reasons cannot
participate in chapter activities for some way to 'belong' without having to
join a local chapter that they cannot actively participate in and whose news
is of little interest to them. We are not providing these members (and
potential members, for many chapter members can tell you tales of people who
have refused to join because they can't participate) with very much value for
their money as it stands. The establishment of an 'online chapter' with a
mailing list, a chat room, and an associated web site/newsletter - and, of
course, the CQ - would be an outreach to these people. We are LOSING
potential members over this.

There is also the point to be made that such an on-line chapter would be much
more 'handicapped accessible' for those members/potential members with
physical disabilities. (What obligations do we have with our Incorporation
status, to be accessible? I honestly don't know, but it might be a point to
consider.)

No, it's not quite the same as a 'physical' chapter with face-to-face
meetings. But the potential membership population is one that already cannot
take advantage of that.

As for manipulation of membership numbers - it's not any different from the
situation that exists with the chapters. Really, it's not. Those numbers
could be manipulated just as easily. (And I can think of several ways it
could be done).

I DO believe that a well thought out and drafted 'virtual chapter' concept
could be made to work. I'm NOT suggesting something thrown together hastily.
It would have to be considered how members could qualify for, what particular
benefits should be offered, how things would be arranged. I'm not talking
about 'just' a discussion list, but much more. I am not familiar with the
details of Mike's proposal. Maybe it was not the 'right time' for such a
proposal a year ago, or it was not well thought out. Just because an idea
doesn't work at one point does not mean that it should never be considered
again. Times and situations change, and it has become obvious that such has
happened here.

This is something that could both bring in new memberships and new blood and
help us retain members we might otherwise lose.

MVM

<>


To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com

Hello,

I am really wondering with all of the talking back and forth, Has anyone
gotten the second issue of the CQ. I know that it was mailed. I sealed,
labeled, sorted, banded, weighed, lugged all of them to the post office.

Can someone out there let me know if you received them. I know that they
were mailed. I have already gotten 12 of them back. (these were not on the
lost and found, I did not send any of those out)

If you have, drop me a line saying yes. Also did you like any of the
articles, what would you like to see more of. Anything would be of a help.

Thanks for caring.

Dora Buck
Assistant Editor and Slave

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That is exactly the argument. I've been there. When first heard of the ICG in about 90-91, I wrote to someone (think it may have been Jana Keeler). After about a year, I got a letter back stating that there were no chapters in TX, (did you have me in mind Ken?) but I could join a chapter in another state. It really didn't seem like a good idea. Or start my own chapter, I already had the SCA as a costuming outlet and didn't have time to start another club. After seeing the ICG first hand at WorldCon '97 (San Antonio), I decided to join. I checked out all the chapters on the website. $20 to pups in NJ, really didn't seem worth it. Looked closer to home. Checked out the websites for SLCG and SWCG. About the same distance, in the event I ever decided to attend a meeting. SLCG just seemed like a better group, so I joined. From where I lived, SLCG was 900 miles away, about 14 hrs. The newletter was fun to read, the things they did sounded like alot of fun, but I couldn't participate. It was sort of depressing sometimes.

I am now a member of MCG (Rocky Mntn) and live 60 miles from the majority of the other members. We have 2 members in 2 other states and 1 on the other side of the state. I'm sure that our isolated members often have the same feelings. But our chapter dues are dirt cheap, so it's not a huge loss.

Bruno
Millennium CG

>
>True, but here's the counter-argument that I've been seeing:
>
>I live in West Podunk, Texas, 4+ hours from the closest ICG member, and 6+
>hours from the center of activity of the closest chapter. I have a choice of
>joining a number of chapters of the ICG, all of which will charge me money
>to receive a newsletter filled with interesting events that I can't attend.
>(In other words, the newsletter is useful only for it's entertainment value,
>not the information it contains.) I will also have no say in anything the
>chapter might do. (No ICG chapter I know of allows mail-in or phone voting
>on matters brought before the chapter at a business meeting. Some chapters
>allow voting by proxy, I believe, but I don't know, for example, if the Sick
>Pups do.)
>
>Why, then, should I pay good money for something from which I receive no
>benefit other than to be allowed to pay *more* money for what I really
>wanted, ICG membership?
>
>I think this is the essence of Lisa and Nova's argument.
>
>Ken Warren
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>

Elaine,

I have already posed that thought to Byron/the BOD. As the moderator of a costume "club" on Yahoo!Clubs many of the people on there are isolated from other costumers except online. Several people on the group said that they would be interested in joining the ICG. I feel they seemed more interested in joining as a virtual chapter where they can chat with other members, rather than joining a group in another state that they had no contact with other than a newsletter.

The motion was shot down at the last meeting due to the same constraints that chapters are connected to specific geographic areas.

Bruno
Millennium CG

>Since the rules say we must be chapter members, but more and more people
>don't live close to even the minimum 6 people needed to become a chapter,
>why not create a "virtual" chapter solely for far-flung folks? They could
>"meet" on-line, if they so desired. They could even hold an annual meeting
>at a CC (what a concept!). My point is that we might be able to meet both
>the letter and the spirit of the rule, while trying to find other solutions.
>

I wasn't going to comment on the CQ discussion... but I've been burned
before on letting "sleeping dogs lays", so I'm going to clarify a little bit
of history while I was CQ editor.

When I took over the CQ it has the same problems as Carl has had. Catch up
back issues and get out new issues timely. I chose to issues "current"
issues and catch up the remaining back issues as a double (after the two
rapid fire issues that came out in 3 1/2 weeks and then 2 1/2 weeks after I
took over the editorship).

1) The big problem was that the address issue was even worse than the one
that Carl was encountering on the returns of the first issue and reprint of
the last CQ of the previous editor (which the bulk mail system ate and only
delivered to a small fraction of the members. The recognition of the address
problem left me w/ a printed issues I couldn't send. Also, it was
impossible to even determine the number to print of future issues. (I ran
on a real tight margin and couldn't afford to shoulder all the costs and
just keep resending.)

Basically, the issues got done on time and went out to the Australians (and
I believe the Canadians) who did their own printing and distributing. It
was the US that didn't get their issues on time because I COULDN'T DO THE
MAILING, not because the issues WERE NOT done. The US's outstanding issues
went out in a batch once there were labels and within a week of labels.
(Yes, this made certain sections and articles obsolete for the US members.)

I know that the WHY matters little to the members who are not getting
issues, but the flame mail back then couldn't make the distinction even
after discussion. It is good to see that folks are listening to Carl this
time round and seem to be believing him when he states the large wastage
that occurs because of addressing and membership roster MIS-information.
This is the part that needs fixing. Once the faith is back in the CQ,
hopeful the faith in the CQ will bring the articles back, too.

2) Other history: when chapters mentioned that their members still hadn't
gotten issues, I asked for address to be sent directly to me both at the ICG
meeting (you'll find it in the minuets) and I reminded people in other
forums and privately to send the address. Those that did, got their issues.
They went out 1st class, I paid the postage personally. I never heard from
other chapters, even after personal e-mails. Some cases were that they
wanted new issues not the back issues... but that should not be lumped in
with never getting them.

I'm leaving out all name here, because all I'm doing is setting a little bit
of history straight that keeps getting mauled and I do not wish to restart
any of the flame wars that have gone on in the CQ's tattered past.

Let's not worry about past finger pointing. Instead, let's just all really
work with Carl and the Board of Directors and see if we can get these
problems fixed. To handle costs, maybe we have to take the page count down
again. Once money and articles flow then we can move the page count back
up. And, maybe we all need to have a little faith in the CQ and start the
stream of articles even as these issues are being worked out.

Also, I 2nd the comment about local editors sending Carl a copy of their
newsletter. There are great gems in the local issues to be mined.

And to the answered question, got my CQ last week. I'm in the San Fernando
Valley area of Los Angeles.

-Cat-

Hi all,

Wearing a totally different hat here than at my last posting... On behalf of
Costume Con's 19 Fashion Folio, I'm issuing a special plea just to this
list. (It's not going out into the big wide world in this format.)

We desperately need designs for the Fashion Folio. We have had submissions
only from four artists so far. Please could you take time to do one or two
drawings -- either an entire outfit or an accessory. Please. Please.
Please.

Just black and white line draw is fine, you don't have to color them in. If
you've got items from past years, you can just send them in the format you
reading them for then. We're not going to be picky if the descriptions is
on the front or back... and remember, each set of judges has a different
criteria and likes/sense of humor.

The new extended deadline is listed as a Halloween postmark. However, not
all mail takes 3 weeks. I will take them up to the time we judge, which is
right now Thanksgiving weekend. Deliver them by carrier pigeon w/o a
postmark or scan and send... it doesn't matter. We just desperately need to
make up a fusion folio.

You'll find the updated standard rules on my new web site
(www.AlleyCatScratch.com) and some ideas based on galactic shopping on the
official web site (linked though mine or the CC19 address). Also there are
figures of both men and women to download and trace available off links
there.

Mail the designs to my address: Cat Devereaux, 6128 Cahuenga Blvd, #102,
North Hollywood, CA 91606.

Please. Please. Please help. (Cat's groveling here... time to swap
favors... and ya know I honor the swaps.)

If any of you are new and are looking for even more details on the folio
contact me...

Just for general information, I plan on setting aside a whole section of my
web for the fashion folio in the future. I'll have picture and art examples
as well as articles by people like Fran Evans and Alison Kondo. (Gee, I
have the old CQ text, so I don't even have to retype them.) If you want to
contribute, or have ideas on what you'd like to see... give me a yelp.

OK, I'll be quite now... if you promise to draw.

-Cat-
CC19 Folio Judge, Assistant to Folio director, and full time nagger

We've not recieved the SLCG issue yet.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dora Buck" <dfbuck@hotmail.com>
To: <ICG-D@egroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2000 7:17 PM
Subject: [ICG-D] Second Issue


> Hello,
>
> I am really wondering with all of the talking back and forth, Has anyone
> gotten the second issue of the CQ. I know that it was mailed. I sealed,
> labeled, sorted, banded, weighed, lugged all of them to the post office.
>
> Can someone out there let me know if you received them. I know that they
> were mailed. I have already gotten 12 of them back. (these were not on
the
> lost and found, I did not send any of those out)
>
> If you have, drop me a line saying yes. Also did you like any of the
> articles, what would you like to see more of. Anything would be of a
help.
>
> Thanks for caring.
>
> Dora Buck
> Assistant Editor and Slave
>
> _________________________________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
>
> Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at
> http://profiles.msn.com
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>

Oh yeah. I completely forgot Cat's time as Editor. I remember that time.
Anyway, maybe reducing page count might be an idea, for the short term

Let me go on record as saying in response to somebody (who I'm too lazy to
check who it was), we do not want "how-to" stuff in the Annual. That's not
what it's for. It should be a snapshot of the Guild's activitis of the past
year. Think high school and college yearbook.

Meantime, we seem to have gotten WAYYYYY off track with this discussion,
and we would like the Board to review our proposal. It was not supposed to
be dragged into this forum yet.

Bruce

Bruce and Nora Mai
Costuming and Cats -- It must be Casa Mai!
http://members.xoom.com/CasaMai/casamai/splashx.html

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cat Devereaux" <CatDevereaux@AlleyCatScratch.com>
To: "International Costumer's Guild" <ICG-D@egroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 12:03 AM
Subject: [ICG-D] CQ historical comment


> I wasn't going to comment on the CQ discussion... but I've been burned
> before on letting "sleeping dogs lays", so I'm going to clarify a little
bit
> of history while I was CQ editor.
>
> When I took over the CQ it has the same problems as Carl has had. Catch
up
> back issues and get out new issues timely. I chose to issues "current"
> issues and catch up the remaining back issues as a double (after the two
> rapid fire issues that came out in 3 1/2 weeks and then 2 1/2 weeks after
I
> took over the editorship).
>
> 1) The big problem was that the address issue was even worse than the one
> that Carl was encountering on the returns of the first issue and reprint
of
> the last CQ of the previous editor (which the bulk mail system ate and
only
> delivered to a small fraction of the members. The recognition of the
address
> problem left me w/ a printed issues I couldn't send. Also, it was
> impossible to even determine the number to print of future issues. (I ran
> on a real tight margin and couldn't afford to shoulder all the costs and
> just keep resending.)
>
> Basically, the issues got done on time and went out to the Australians
(and
> I believe the Canadians) who did their own printing and distributing. It
> was the US that didn't get their issues on time because I COULDN'T DO THE
> MAILING, not because the issues WERE NOT done. The US's outstanding
issues
> went out in a batch once there were labels and within a week of labels.
> (Yes, this made certain sections and articles obsolete for the US
members.)
>
> I know that the WHY matters little to the members who are not getting
> issues, but the flame mail back then couldn't make the distinction even
> after discussion. It is good to see that folks are listening to Carl this
> time round and seem to be believing him when he states the large wastage
> that occurs because of addressing and membership roster MIS-information.
> This is the part that needs fixing. Once the faith is back in the CQ,
> hopeful the faith in the CQ will bring the articles back, too.
>
> 2) Other history: when chapters mentioned that their members still hadn't
> gotten issues, I asked for address to be sent directly to me both at the
ICG
> meeting (you'll find it in the minuets) and I reminded people in other
> forums and privately to send the address. Those that did, got their
issues.
> They went out 1st class, I paid the postage personally. I never heard
from
> other chapters, even after personal e-mails. Some cases were that they
> wanted new issues not the back issues... but that should not be lumped in
> with never getting them.
>
> I'm leaving out all name here, because all I'm doing is setting a little
bit
> of history straight that keeps getting mauled and I do not wish to restart
> any of the flame wars that have gone on in the CQ's tattered past.
>
> Let's not worry about past finger pointing. Instead, let's just all
really
> work with Carl and the Board of Directors and see if we can get these
> problems fixed. To handle costs, maybe we have to take the page count down
> again. Once money and articles flow then we can move the page count back
> up. And, maybe we all need to have a little faith in the CQ and start the
> stream of articles even as these issues are being worked out.
>
> Also, I 2nd the comment about local editors sending Carl a copy of their
> newsletter. There are great gems in the local issues to be mined.
>
> And to the answered question, got my CQ last week. I'm in the San
Fernando
> Valley area of Los Angeles.
>
> -Cat-
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>

On Wed, 11 Oct 2000, Byron Connell wrote:

> A year ago, Mike Bruno proposed creating an "electronic
> chapter." Before he went ahead to prepare a request for
> recognition of such a chapter, I asked the Board of Directors to
> state their views. At that time, most Board members disliked the
> idea. They saw it as no different from any discussion list --
> including this one -- and providing no real benefit to its "members."

Perhaps, for the benefit of newcomers, someone would elucidate "benefit to
its members" of the current system? I'm getting more news and interesting
communication from this list than I've ever seen from any other ICG item.

> They also pointed out that the number of members of such a
> chapter could easily be manipulated without the rest of the ICG
> being any the wiser.
>

Apparently, this has been a problem with the chapters already.

Linda Peterson
mirhaxa@morktorn.com

Because of the way the ICG is put together, I do not see why a chapter at
large cannot simply be formed right now. It is up to the chapter as to
where they are located and how they communicate. Discussion here as to the
merits is interesting, but, I think, actually unnecessary. There are
responsible chapters and irresponsible chapters already. There are already
geographically remote chapter members, and members that do not attend
meetings. Obviously, there is a need and a desire for some such
group. If a new chapter forms, they must follow the procedure set up for
new chapters to join the ICG. The existing chapters differ in focus,
activity level and communication style; this would merely be another variation.
Although we are currently GBACG members, we have not attended any event in
years, but I have written articles , Bruce is on the ICG budget committee,
and we have a presence here, on line. We find that the local group does
not meet our needs. Our interest and support is to the ICG. We would
gladly join through a no-meeting-probable chapter.
By the way, I was pushing this idea way back when I was on the ICG
board. At that time, I was also arguing that the ICG needed a newsletter
rather than a quasi-Journal. The shared information and communication to
all the members is what makes an organization. Of course, neither Journal
(Quarterly) nor Newsletter will work if no one contributes.
Dana MacDermott

Having never actually seen one, I've always envisioned the CQ as being the ICG equivalent to the SCA's quarterly "Tounaments Illuminated" Does anyone else think so?

Bruno
Millennium CG

Linda,

I think that part of the issue that the BOD had with a "virtual"/non-geographic chapter is that costuming is a visual and hand's on art. If people are not meeting face to face, then you lose the visual and hand's on aspect.

However, if the closest ICG chapter to you is 900 miles away, you sort of lose the visual and hands on aspect anyway.

Bruno
Millennium CG

PS Will you be at MileHi this year?

>> idea. They saw it as no different from any discussion list --
>> including this one -- and providing no real benefit to its "members."
>
>Perhaps, for the benefit of newcomers, someone would elucidate "benefit to
>its members" of the current system? I'm getting more news and interesting
>communication from this list than I've ever seen from any other ICG item.
>

I think that the idea of joining an international organization would be more appealing to geographically isolated persons that joining a small group somewhere else. Joining the ICG at the international level would entitle one to a fancy membership card, the quarterly, and perhaps other spiffy things such as discounts at chain fabric stores, maybe even a discount on CC membership. Then if they chose to particapate with a local costumers guild, if one is near, it is an option and dues and benefits are governed by that chapter.

I can't help but think of it in the same terms as the SCA. You join the international organization and get the quarterly, but participate with whatever chapter you live in or near.

Bruno

Dunno. I've never seen the SCA publication.

Byron

>>> plastic@mail.codenet.net 10/12/00 03:43PM >>>

Having never actually seen one, I've always envisioned the CQ as being the ICG equivalent to the SCA's quarterly "Tounaments Illuminated" Does anyone else think so?

Bruno
Millennium CG



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com

In a message dated 10/12/00 12:28:59 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
plastic@mail.codenet.net writes:

> Having never actually seen one, I've always envisioned the CQ as being the
> ICG equivalent to the SCA's quarterly "Tounaments Illuminated" Does anyone
> else think so?
>
> Bruno
> Millennium CG

That was my assumption also when I first heard of the publication. The
articles I have sent to CQ in the past are in much the same vein, though not
the restricted period, of articles I have submitted for TI

Randall
SWCG
Barony of Atenveldt

I get the digest form of this list and when someone quotes the ENTIRE
post that they're replying to, the postings get extremely long. Please
select a relevant sentence or two, not several screenfuls of quotes!
--
Janice Dallas
Boston,MA area, USA
JaniceDals@MediaOne.net
"Just so, the girl has beauty, virtue, wit..."

Although I wasn't arguing the point, it looks like I opened a can of worms while
making inquiries. Lisa, Nova & Ken all express the same things that I have been
thinking for some time. Club dues normally entitle one to something besides a
newsletter. Meetings are normally FUN as well as informative. Activities are
funded not only through donations but through DUES. Members are normally
granted perks such as "group rates" to conventions, group shopping sprees to
bulk fabric stores, etc. which cannot be enjoyed by memberships at a great
distance. Those of you lucky enough to live in a geographical location near
good, strong chapter leaders may not remember what it was like to be floundering
in the wastelands. Even here in Chattanooga, there are lots of people, lots of
costumers but no one to lead a group. And DON'T look at me!

Hugs,
Susan

Ken Warren wrote:

> I live in West Podunk, Texas, 4+ hours from the closest ICG member, and 6+
> hours from the center of activity of the closest chapter. I have a choice of
> joining a number of chapters of the ICG, all of which will charge me money
> to receive a newsletter filled with interesting events that I can't attend.
> (In other words, the newsletter is useful only for it's entertainment value,
> not the information it contains.) I will also have no say in anything the
> chapter might do. <snip>
>
> Why, then, should I pay good money for something from which I receive no
> benefit other than to be allowed to pay *more* money for what I really
> wanted, ICG membership?
>
> I think this is the essence of Lisa and Nova's argument.

> If it's going to be done on-line, you need someone patient to walk
> people who are new to the on-line experience through things and help them
> out. Dues would be up to the group.

I nominate John O!

Hugs,
Susan

Texas was the same way. Lots of people, lots of costumers, but spread out all across the big giant state.

Bruno

>in the wastelands. Even here in Chattanooga, there are lots of people, lots of
>costumers but no one to lead a group. And DON'T look at me!
>
>Hugs,
>Susan

I wanted to announce our new arrival, but I'm not at all sure it will be
seen in light of the 100+ messages about the future of the ICG... Whew!

I'm recovering from a C-Section, and will reserve comment until I feel a
whole lot better about sitting in front of a computer, but here's the
details:

Erin Frances Delaney was born on October 5, 2000, at 4:32pm by C-Section
after 36 hours of questionably successful labor. She was 7lbs, 13.3oz.,
20.25 inches long, and scored two 9's on her Apgar tests. (She's already
an overachiever!)

Pictures and a lovely writeup (courtesy of Dan and my assistant Barb)
are available through our What's New page on Hawkeswood Productions,

http://www.hawkeswood.com/whatsnew.shtml

I'm recovering and feeling well enough to write this, but not well
enough to follow the various threads of the ICG discussion underway at
the moment.

Cat - Sorry I couldn't get the announcement of the Fashion Folio changes
up on the Costume-ConNections site fast enough - I've been saying I was
going to go early, but I didn't believe my own press - I was due October
9!

I hope to have changes up as soon as I can arrange to have them written
and transferred - should be some time next week, when I'm feeling more
up to being in front of a computer for another hour.

Hope the organization is still around when I check back in next week...

Cheers!

Betsy (Dan and Erin)

--
Betsy R. Delaney
Web Mistress at large
WebInvent.com, Inc.

************************************************************************
mailto:WebInvent@WebInvent.com or visit http://www.WebInvent.com/
mailto:Costume-Con@Costume-Con.org or visit http://www.Costume-Con.org/
mailto:betsy@hawkeswood.com or visit http://www.hawkeswood.com/
************************************************************************

Dear Dora--

I got my CQ and I liked the articles, the one by Sharon and the one by
Byron. I even learned something.

Yours in costuming,
Lisa A.
Who is in the middle of a 4 day costuming blitz to prepare for ARisia and
it's very late at night
________________________________________________________________
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Congratulations Betsy Dan and Erin! Erin is a gorgeous looking,
well, I can't see her hair color, but yep, she looks like a baby.

Take it easy lady. I know c-sections are no fun. For those of you
who don't know, think major abdominal surgery and you'll get the
idea. It's just that the result is more rewarding.

Remember Crying is for exercising the lungs. Erin doesn't need
you every time, just every other time, and you have the joy of
trying to figure out which ones are important (she hasn't a
clue).

Also fun is to catch up on your video tapes while breastfeeding.
It's actually easier than trying to read.

Relax and we'll see you whenever.

Lisa, Grandma to 2 1/2 (Jenevieve is expecting #3 sometime in
April)

Betsy Delaney wrote:

> I wanted to announce our new arrival, but I'm not at all sure
> it will be
> seen in light of the 100+ messages about the future of the
> ICG... Whew!
> Pictures and a lovely writeup (courtesy of Dan and my assistant
> Barb)
> are available through our What's New page on Hawkeswood
> Productions,
>
> http://www.hawkeswood.com/whatsnew.shtml
>

We have ours.

Pierre and Sandy

At 08:17 PM 10/11/00 EDT, you wrote:

>Hello,
>
>I am really wondering with all of the talking back and forth, Has anyone
>gotten the second issue of the CQ. I know that it was mailed. I sealed,
>labeled, sorted, banded, weighed, lugged all of them to the post office.
>
>Can someone out there let me know if you received them. I know that they
>were mailed. I have already gotten 12 of them back. (these were not on the
>lost and found, I did not send any of those out)
>
>If you have, drop me a line saying yes. Also did you like any of the
>articles, what would you like to see more of. Anything would be of a help.
>
>Thanks for caring.
>
>Dora Buck
>Assistant Editor and Slave
>
>_________________________________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
>
>Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at
>http://profiles.msn.com
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
>

Dora Buck wrote:

>
> Hello,
>
> I am really wondering with all of the talking back and forth, Has anyone
> gotten the second issue of the CQ.

Dear Dora,

Last week, I received CQ Volume 13 Number 1, the same issue Eileen and I
collected from Carl at CC 18. Is there another one we should have
received?

-- Katherine Jepson
for the Western Canadian Costumers Guild

Yeah! I finally, actually got to read ALL the Email. I apologize for
occasionally answering things without reading all the discussion. After
all is said & done, I choose to join the SLUTS. I've met the SLUTS, I
like the SLUTS, I've always been a Slut in my heart so I need the
button. If and when a Cyber chapter starts, I'll join that one too, but
I don't need two copies of the CQ, K?

In case you folks didn't know, its Halloween now. I run a costume
rental/retail shop & my life is getting really tight. We are now into
the $2K days and climbing steadily toward the $10K days. That's a LOT
of people to deal with when each one averages a $25 sale & my small shop
comfortably holds only about 20 people at a time. If the fire marshal
ever saw how many people jam themselves in there the last week of
October, they would shut us down. That means 12+ hours a day, 6 days a
week for me & my son's birthday is the 20th. So, you folks will
understand if I my answers get cryptic. I promise I didn't mean to
start up a debate just to duck out & watch the fireworks.

Hugs,
Susan

> >I am really wondering with all of the talking back and forth, Has anyone
> >gotten the second issue of the CQ. I know that it was mailed. I sealed,
> >labeled, sorted, banded, weighed, lugged all of them to the post office.

If you mean the issue with Byron's research article on WWI uniforms, Yes it
arrived both at the SWCG mailbox and at my home about two weeks ago.

Carl, did you receive my cape article sent about 4 days ago to your home.com
address?

Randall
SWCG

Hey everybody--

A national chapter that provides ICG membership and supports the CQ, with
optional membership to this list, seems like a sensible solution for
those who are not near a chapter that they can play with.

An electronic/cyber/on-line chapter seems less friendly.

Would it be possible for the BoD to authorize a test, or model, chapter?
If it starts (approximately) now and runs through CostumeCon '02 that
allows for one Worldcon's worth of advertising/luring.

Bruce B.

"It's kind of fun to do the impossible." --Walt Disney

________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
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> From: Betsy Delaney <betsy@hawkeswood.com>
> I wanted to announce our new arrival, but I'm not at all sure it will be
> seen in light of the 100+ messages about the future of the ICG... Whew!

Yes, but you left out the most important news, what will her first costume
will be?

-C.

Christopher Ballis wrote:

>
> > From: Betsy Delaney <betsy@hawkeswood.com>
> > I wanted to announce our new arrival, but I'm not at all sure it will be
> > seen in light of the 100+ messages about the future of the ICG... Whew!
>
> Yes, but you left out the most important news, what will her first costume
> will be?
>
> -C.

Actually, she was in "costume" before she was born. As a matter of
fact, she was in a Best in Show presentation!

Karen

> Actually, she was in "costume" before she was born. As a matter of
> fact, she was in a Best in Show presentation!

:)

If you want a newsletter that is free and not notably
full of discussions about about fun things the chapter
has been doing, why not check ours out? We do actually
have a milestone-two first person accounts, but one is
about WorldCon, not really a local event. In both
cases they'd been sent to wider lists and I had to ask
the members for reprinting rights. Much of the
newsletter is devoted to web resources rather than
geographically-based issues. Anyway, considering how
big our geographic area is, a member from Ohio or
Minnesota is likely to feel just as frustrated as you
Texans as far as an event being mentioned that they
can't get to.
Carol
http://www.egroups.com/group/ccghitlist




=====
Carol Mitchell President Chicagoland Costumer's Guild
Manager Costume Programming Track Chicon 2000
Co-chair CostumeCon 21

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
http://im.yahoo.com/

Betsy et al,

Many congratulations! Will she be on stage at PhilCon?

Love,

Elaine et al

>From: Betsy Delaney <betsy@hawkeswood.com>
>Reply-To: ICG-D@egroups.com
>To: ICG Mailing List <ICG-D@egroups.com>
>Subject: [ICG-D] Geez - go have a baby, and the world falls apart!
>Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 17:58:14 -0400
>
>I wanted to announce our new arrival, but I'm not at all sure it will be
>seen in light of the 100+ messages about the future of the ICG... Whew!
>
>I'm recovering from a C-Section, and will reserve comment until I feel a
>whole lot better about sitting in front of a computer, but here's the
>details:
>
>Erin Frances Delaney was born on October 5, 2000, at 4:32pm by C-Section
>after 36 hours of questionably successful labor. She was 7lbs, 13.3oz.,
>20.25 inches long, and scored two 9's on her Apgar tests. (She's already
>an overachiever!)
>
>Pictures and a lovely writeup (courtesy of Dan and my assistant Barb)
>are available through our What's New page on Hawkeswood Productions,
>
> http://www.hawkeswood.com/whatsnew.shtml
>
>I'm recovering and feeling well enough to write this, but not well
>enough to follow the various threads of the ICG discussion underway at
>the moment.
>
>Cat - Sorry I couldn't get the announcement of the Fashion Folio changes
>up on the Costume-ConNections site fast enough - I've been saying I was
>going to go early, but I didn't believe my own press - I was due October
>9!
>
>I hope to have changes up as soon as I can arrange to have them written
>and transferred - should be some time next week, when I'm feeling more
>up to being in front of a computer for another hour.
>
>Hope the organization is still around when I check back in next week...
>
>Cheers!
>
>Betsy (Dan and Erin)
>
>--
>Betsy R. Delaney
>Web Mistress at large
>WebInvent.com, Inc.
>
>************************************************************************
>mailto:WebInvent@WebInvent.com or visit http://www.WebInvent.com/
>mailto:Costume-Con@Costume-Con.org or visit http://www.Costume-Con.org/
>mailto:betsy@hawkeswood.com or visit http://www.hawkeswood.com/
>************************************************************************

_________________________________________________________________________
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Dear Betsy--

Hope everything is going well in these first few weeks.

Remember, you have had MAJOR abdominal surgery (and usually they let
you stay in the hospital longer, and you don't have to take care of a
baby when you go home, but you have people taking care of you). So
don't try to do too much. Rest is paramount.

Talk to you soon.

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

Betsy --

Congratulations and best wishes to you, Dan and Erin.

Byron

>>> betsy@hawkeswood.com 10/13/00 05:58PM >>>

I wanted to announce our new arrival, but I'm not at all sure it will be
seen in light of the 100+ messages about the future of the ICG... Whew!

I'm recovering from a C-Section, and will reserve comment until I feel a
whole lot better about sitting in front of a computer, but here's the
details:

Erin Frances Delaney was born on October 5, 2000, at 4:32pm by C-Section
after 36 hours of questionably successful labor. She was 7lbs, 13.3oz.,
20.25 inches long, and scored two 9's on her Apgar tests. (She's already
an overachiever!)

Pictures and a lovely writeup (courtesy of Dan and my assistant Barb)
are available through our What's New page on Hawkeswood Productions,

http://www.hawkeswood.com/whatsnew.shtml

I'm recovering and feeling well enough to write this, but not well
enough to follow the various threads of the ICG discussion underway at
the moment.

Cat - Sorry I couldn't get the announcement of the Fashion Folio changes
up on the Costume-ConNections site fast enough - I've been saying I was
going to go early, but I didn't believe my own press - I was due October
9!

I hope to have changes up as soon as I can arrange to have them written
and transferred - should be some time next week, when I'm feeling more
up to being in front of a computer for another hour.

Hope the organization is still around when I check back in next week...

Cheers!

Betsy (Dan and Erin)

--
Betsy R. Delaney
Web Mistress at large
WebInvent.com, Inc.

************************************************************************
mailto:WebInvent@WebInvent.com or visit http://www.WebInvent.com/
mailto:Costume-Con@Costume-Con.org or visit http://www.Costume-Con.org/
mailto:betsy@hawkeswood.com or visit http://www.hawkeswood.com/
************************************************************************


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Attachments :

Thought I'd throw this out to the group, from one of our members:

> -Poster: SpkDPnch@aol.com
>
> Been doing some research for a mechanical suit idea that I have had in my
> head for quite some time, and have not seen too much on the web about how
> others have made robot suits, or other mechanical constructs.
> So far, I am at a loss what to use. Considered using plastic, but am not

too

> happy about the inflexiblity or weight. Vacuforming seems to require too

much

> in tooling. And fiberglass has its own share of problems.
>
> Any hints or teasers will be appreciated.
>
> Spiked Punch
> ICQ: 36818888
> Alpha wolf of ARF: http://stlf.org/ARF/
> http://www.furnation.com/ARF/
> Homepage: http://www.lycanthrope.net/~spiked
> http://www.furnation.com/spiked_punch

Cardboard with silver spray paint. I've seen it done.

> Poster: SpkDPnch@aol.com
>
> So far, I am at a loss what to use. Considered using plastic, but
> am not too happy about the inflexiblity or weight. Vacuforming
> seems to require too much in tooling. And fiberglass has its own
> share of problems.

How about air-brushed foam?

Elaine

>From: "Bruce & Nora Mai" <casamai@primary.net>
>Reply-To: ICG-D@egroups.com
>To: <ICG-D@egroups.com>
>Subject: [ICG-D] Mecha suit
>Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 22:39:09 -0500
>
>Thought I'd throw this out to the group, from one of our members:
>
> > -Poster: SpkDPnch@aol.com
> >
> > Been doing some research for a mechanical suit idea that I have had in
>my
> > head for quite some time, and have not seen too much on the web about
>how
> > others have made robot suits, or other mechanical constructs.
> > So far, I am at a loss what to use. Considered using plastic, but am
>not
>too
> > happy about the inflexiblity or weight. Vacuforming seems to require too
>much
> > in tooling. And fiberglass has its own share of problems.
> >
> > Any hints or teasers will be appreciated.
> >
> > Spiked Punch
> > ICQ: 36818888
> > Alpha wolf of ARF: http://stlf.org/ARF/
> > http://www.furnation.com/ARF/
> > Homepage: http://www.lycanthrope.net/~spiked
> > http://www.furnation.com/spiked_punch
>
>

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Ditto with stiffened fabric painted silver -- but it <has> to be seriously stiffened before you apply the paint.

Byron

>>> eoin@tyedye.org 10/19/00 03:18AM >>>

Cardboard with silver spray paint. I've seen it done.

> Poster: SpkDPnch@aol.com
>
> So far, I am at a loss what to use. Considered using plastic, but
> am not too happy about the inflexiblity or weight. Vacuforming
> seems to require too much in tooling. And fiberglass has its own
> share of problems.

The Imperial Walker, Conadian, was made using foam core board wrapping a
1x2 - 2x2 frame. The Alien Power Loader, also Conadian, was skinned by my
friend with foam core board as well. Foam core is a nice medium for doing
mecha-type costumes. Painted right, and it takes paint well, it can be
mistaken for metal even from close up. At 3 feet one guy swore to his buddy
that the Power Loader was made of sheet metal! He wouldn't believe my
friend until she let him pick up one of the arms. If I were to do another
mecha costume, I'd probably use foam core.

Scott
______________________________________________________
Scott Corwin & Sheila Lenkman
scorwin@i1.net

Archon Masquerade - http://www.stlf.org/archon/masquerade.html
Gateway Masquerade - http://www.stlf.org/gateway
______________________________________________________

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce & Nora Mai" <casamai@primary.net>
To: <ICG-D@egroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2000 10:39 PM
Subject: [ICG-D] Mecha suit


> Thought I'd throw this out to the group, from one of our members:
>
> > -Poster: SpkDPnch@aol.com
> >
> > Been doing some research for a mechanical suit idea that I have had in
my
> > head for quite some time, and have not seen too much on the web about
how
> > others have made robot suits, or other mechanical constructs.
> > So far, I am at a loss what to use. Considered using plastic, but am
not
> too
> > happy about the inflexiblity or weight. Vacuforming seems to require too
> much
> > in tooling. And fiberglass has its own share of problems.
> >
> > Any hints or teasers will be appreciated.
> >
> > Spiked Punch
> > ICQ: 36818888
> > Alpha wolf of ARF: http://stlf.org/ARF/
> > http://www.furnation.com/ARF/
> > Homepage: http://www.lycanthrope.net/~spiked
> > http://www.furnation.com/spiked_punch
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>

As a result of ongoing as well as recent problems with the BoD and its
agents, at the most recent regular meeting of the Greater Portland Area CG
(Saturday, 14 Oct 2000), we voted unanimously to secede from the ICG. We
will remain an active, independant, local guild under our own auspices.


If there are any questions, comments, anything, please direct them to us in
private as we expect to be removed from the ICG list serves at any time
after this posting.



Signed,
Brenna Sharp, President
Greater Portland Area Costumers' Guild
Portland, OR

raven@xprt.net

Yes you could use airbrush-painted foam that was carved or shaped, but
the foam has to be attached to something. I've seen sort of what the
author is the request is asking about using tricot lame, sometimes
quilted. But you still have to make the pattern for making it in pieces;
i.e. wrist guards or gloves, shin guards, chest piece, etc.

It could certainly be done with cardboard sheets, cut and "jointed" with
fasteners.

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
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I reccomend foamcore. It's a quarter-inch thick sheet of stiff foam
sandwiched between two sheets of poster-paper-like board. It can be cut and
hot glued or white glued. Takes spray paint or brush-on well. It's what I
have in mind for my own mech. I also have a pair of "Stiltz" brand, heavy
gauge plastic stilts around which to build the feet. They're two feet tall.
Foamcore can be had at "If It's Paper" and most well-stocked craft stores.
Comes in 4x8 and 4x4 foot sheets.
Gristle P.

John O'Halloran wrote:

> Cardboard with silver spray paint. I've seen it done.
>
> > Poster: SpkDPnch@aol.com
> >
> > So far, I am at a loss what to use. Considered using plastic, but
> > am not too happy about the inflexiblity or weight. Vacuforming
> > seems to require too much in tooling. And fiberglass has its own
> > share of problems.
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com