Messages in ICG-D group. 2000<  >2001 Page 13 of 1020. <  >

Group: ICG-D Message: 602 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Where can one costume compete?
Group: ICG-D Message: 603 From: Daren Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Size isn't everything........
Group: ICG-D Message: 604 From: JPSyms@aol.com Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 605 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 606 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade -
Group: ICG-D Message: 607 From: Bruce & Nora Mai Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 608 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 609 From: randwhit@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 610 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 611 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 612 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 613 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 614 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: locations
Group: ICG-D Message: 615 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Award to the Pettingers!
Group: ICG-D Message: 616 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: 2004 Dates
Group: ICG-D Message: 617 From: de Doc Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 618 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 619 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Size isn't everything........
Group: ICG-D Message: 620 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 621 From: Nebula5@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: FANAC Worldcon Photos
Group: ICG-D Message: 622 From: Timothy Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Divisions/awards
Group: ICG-D Message: 623 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 624 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 625 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 626 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 627 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 628 From: J.A. Kelley Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Chicago TARDIS Masqerade Show Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 629 From: corwyn@kolvir.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: A possibly random thought ...
Group: ICG-D Message: 630 From: Timothy Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 631 From: JBdashoff@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 632 From: randwhit@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 633 From: randwhit@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Chicago TARDIS Masqerade Show Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 634 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 635 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: FANAC Worldcon Photos
Group: ICG-D Message: 636 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 637 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Coppercon
Group: ICG-D Message: 638 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Group: ICG-D Message: 639 From: Timothy Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Starcon Costume Contest
Group: ICG-D Message: 640 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Rennesaince Costumes
Group: ICG-D Message: 641 From: Betsy Delaney Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Group: ICG-D Message: 642 From: carowriter@yahoo.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Group: ICG-D Message: 643 From: carowriter@yahoo.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 644 From: carowriter@yahoo.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
Group: ICG-D Message: 645 From: Timothy Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Group: ICG-D Message: 646 From: Linda Peterson Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Group: ICG-D Message: 647 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Group: ICG-D Message: 648 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 649 From: Carol Mitchell Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Digest Number 62
Group: ICG-D Message: 650 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
Group: ICG-D Message: 651 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade



Group: ICG-D Message: 602 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Where can one costume compete?
> Truly, size is not enough.
>Dana
>


Never mind.

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Group: ICG-D Message: 603 From: Daren Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Size isn't everything........
-----Original Message-----
From: Elaine Mami <ecmami@hotmail.com>
To: ICG-D@egroups.com <ICG-D@egroups.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 6:29 PM
Subject: Re: [ICG-D] Where can one costume compete?
>
>
>
>> Truly, size is not enough.
>>Dana
>>
>
>
>Never mind.
>
>_____

Yeah yeah yeah.................You women are always telling us size doesn't
matter........


;-)

Daren


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Group: ICG-D Message: 604 From: JPSyms@aol.com Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
In a message dated 11/27/2000 10:48:14 PM Eastern Standard Time,
betsy@hawkeswood.com writes:

> Timothy wrote:
> >
> > >KEWL! Atlanta is less than a 2 hour drive for me! That would be tons
of
> > >fun. Hmmm, but 2004? By the time I do WorldCon in Charlotte (fingers
> > >crossed) and then DragonCon.... How much does CostumeCon cost? :-)))
> >
> > Actually, I think the line up would be Costume Con, Dragon Con, then
World
> Con. Quite a busy costume schedule.
> >
> > Personally, I've often wondered why DragonCon was not considered an
> International level competition on the same level as Costume Con and World
> Con. Perhaps, the standing rules could be amended to recognize Dragon.
> >
> > Bruno
>
From my understanding, Dragoncon and Worldcon are going to be on the same
weekend for at least the next five years, so going to both in 2004 will be a
real neat trick anyway. (Not undoable, mind you, depending on when the
respective Masquerades are scheduled at the respective conferences.)
John Syms
Exhibitions Division
Head
Millennium Philcon
Group: ICG-D Message: 605 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Jeff and Susan,

Sandy answered quickly last night and I just read your question, as well as
several of the answers. I thought, since I was very involved in this
debate a number of years ago, I would give my take on the sense of the
question.

The basic ethical question was, one should never compete down. One should
only compete up. Therefore, a reasonable sequence would be to compete at a
local con, move up to a regional and finally to an international
competition. One could easily envision several levels in the local and
regional concepts. So you take your costume to a 300 attendee local, then
to a 600 attendee local, to a 1000 regional and then to a 2500 regional.
There is some feeling, though not universal, that a Nasfic sits between
a regional and an international competition.

Functionally, of course, some sidewise movement is allowable.

At the international level, the ICG only recognizes two; Worldcon and
Costume Con. Mike Bruno mentioned that Dragoncon should be in that
level. At the moment, however, it is not. This is not meant to denigrate
Dragoncon, by the way. However, it would take a motion to the ICG to change
Dragoncon's status, IN THE EYES OF THE ICG.

At the time we worked all this out, the feeling was that one should not
move a costume between Worldcon and Costume Con without substantial
reworking of the costume. That feeling has changed among many (myself
included). There isn't a hard and fast rule here except in reference to a
Masquerade Director's decision.

Keep in mind that a costume can always be shown for exhibition (i.e. not in
competition) at any masquerade at any time, regardless of size or previous
competition history.

I hope this helps.

Pierre



>BTW - Here's a good question for you guys.
>
>What's the ICG platform on entering the same costume in multiple contests?
>
>Many years ago, it was quite common to make a costume and take it "on tour"
>or "make the circuit" for about a year. Back then, we had about 6 small to
>medium sized conventions within a 3 hour car trip of Chattanooga, the Hub of
>Con-dom, in Knoxville, Nashville, Atlanta, Birmingham and Huntsville. They
>used to say that you couldn't compete the same costume at a small convention
>that had already won at a larger, regional con, but as long as you kept
>"moving up" it was ok.
>
>Such as, if we got the chance, Jeff & I would "preview" a costume at
>Chattacon in January then work out the kinks and take it to MOC or DragonCon
>and no one cared. But folks tend to frown on us bringing the winning
>costume from DragonCon to Chattacon the following year, even if did not get
>"previewed" there. Around the SouthEast, if a costume wins at DragonCon,
>the only PC thing to do is retire it or demote it to a Hall Costume.
>
>What about CostumeCon & World Con? Is multiple showings of the same costume
>allowed? Is it just considered tacky, or is there currently a rule against
>it? What about costumes that have been previously shown at other, smaller
>conventions? Is it ok if they didn't win or if they have been revised
>either in design or presentation?
>
>I ask now, not to stir up controversy, but because if Charlotte wins, I'll
>have to know what to tell people. If Atlanta wins CostumeCon, I need to
>know if I can use the same costume for myself that I will use at DragonCon.
>BTW - DragonCon is NOT an ICG sanctioned show, but it IS larger than
>WorldCon with attendance of 20,000 fans and 30-50 entries in the
>Masquerade. Guys & gals, Dragon is HUGE! (See www.DragonCon.org - D*C
>History for information.) What I'm getting at is this: If it's ok to use a
>costume at WorldCon that has been seen/shown/award winning at "smaller"
>conventions, what about DragonCon Winners?
>
>Just Need to Know,
>Hugs,
>Susan
Group: ICG-D Message: 606 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade -
Dear Julie:

>
>Anyone care to share their worst experience?

My friend was doing my make up. She left most of it at home, and had to
improvise. Her husband stepped on my over skirt, and ripped the entire side
out, but was afraid to tell me, the person handling the tapes started
everything at zero, and slowly raised the volume, so that I missed my ques;
and finally, the stage was supposed to be retangular, but one third of the
area, was cut off by a curtain running from centre stage to front stage
right; so my blocking went down the tubes; and we weren't allowed to walk
the stage, because the play ran over time.
Does this count?

Peace
Alixandra
eddana@hotmail.com
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Group: ICG-D Message: 607 From: Bruce & Nora Mai Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
The ICG doesn't "sanction". However, it does beggar the question, what does
qualify a venue for Internatinal status. I honestly don't know. Dana
stated that "size doesn't matter" True enough, so.......?


----- Original Message -----
From: Jeff & Susan Stringer
To: ICG-D@egroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 6:36 AM
Subject: Re: [ICG-D] Multi Use Costume Question


Ok, Let's see if I'm smart enough to reply to several replies in one shot.
#1, Thanks everyone for the info.


Personally, I've often wondered why DragonCon was not considered an
International level
competition on the same level as Costume Con and World Con. Perhaps, the
standing rules could
be amended to recognize Dragon.

Bruno

Dragon has only been this Huge for about 5 years, not long enough to be well
established as a convention with a regular pull of costuming talent to be
considered in the same running as CostumeCon & WorldCon which are, well,
special. Maybe the problem is that age old Chicken & the Egg problem. Why
don't more Master Costumers compete at Dragon? Because there aren't many
Masters there. They also have rather strange judging rules. There are only
two categories, Master/Pro costume and other. The Master Class is normally
eligible only for the Best In Show or nothing at all. Lots of Masters don't
like that and stopped competing. Personally, I think if the ICG were to
consider sanctioning the show, it would do a great deal to upgrade the
quality of costuming at Dragon. But, that's just me, and the ICG has better
things to do.
My understanding is that the ICG bylaws place Worldcon and CostumeCon in a
class unto themselves, and a DragonCon winner can legitamately be competed
up
to them. However as always, the final decision belongs to the Masquerade
Director of that particular Con.
John Syms

Glad to know you can move up from Dragon Masque to WC or CC.

<Snip> the consensus seems to be changing to the point that
it's up to the individual MD. this came about in response to the dropping
numbers of Worldcon entries who were going to CC to compete instead.

Two different venues. One for one's peers, one for a larger audience. Why
not let them compete at both? That way, both venues benefit.

Bruce
GREAT! That means if I end up Masque Mistress at Charlotte 2004, and pick
the unpopular response, everyone gets to yell at me. Thanks a bunch
( But I happen to agree with Bruce, more costumes make for better shows and
increases the quality of competition. Besides, we spend a Ton o' Money on
these things, I think they deserve to be seen more than once.
Ooops, time to get ready for work!
Hugs,
Susan
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Group: ICG-D Message: 608 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/28/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
You should be on stage waiting for your tape to begin when you suddenly realize
that the barely audible sound coming from some indefinible direction IS your
tape...! Susan and I finally assembled a set of Planet Of The Apes costumes that
I have wanted to do forever. My tape recorded at a very low audio level. It
sounded great on my home system, but due to the LACK OF TECH-REHEARSAL at Dragon,
I was unaware of how badly it was going to sound.
The tape was five seconds or so into it's run before I realized that it even
WAS our tape. I looked back at Susan while standing on stage and just shook my
head. But the show must go on and I did the best I could. If there had been a
"Best Pantomime" catagory, we would have taken the trophy. There we were with me
strutting and waving my arms like a good little war monger to James Gregory's
speech to the Ape council as General Ursus. I was so embarassed, I wanted to
crawl under the floor tiles.
Exactly the same thing happened in 1989 at the Atlanta Fantasy Fair with us on
stage as Weber's Phantom & Christine. It had to be one of the best demonstrations
of mime opera ever seen.
Jeff S.


Nebula5@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 11/28/00 2:11:25 PM PST, plastic@mail.codenet.net writes:
>
> > The Master Class is normally eligible only for the Best In Show or nothing
> at all.
>
> Many years ago, when skill divisions were a new thing, they decided to try
> them out at Norwescon. And they decreed that Master class entries were
> eligible for Best in Show _only_, and _only_ Master class entries were
> eligible for Best in Show (follow?). Note: this rule was abandoned the next
> year.
>
> There were two Master entries. Me in a rather subtle (yes!) dark dramatic
> presentation, and a group of my friends in a big bright sparkly flashy funny
> presentation. So it was extremely obvious who was going to win, and who
> wasn't, LONG before we even hit the stage. Add to that the fact that I'd
> forgotten a part of my costume at home, and when I came out on stage they
> played the wrong tape (I turned around and went off; they started again with
> the right tape).
>
> All in all, my most depressing masquerade experience. And it was one of (in
> my opinion) my best costume efforts! Believe me, I don't go into any
> masquerade expecting to win, but it's no fun knowing you're definitely not
> going to win anything - no matter what!
>
> Anyone care to share their worst experience?
>
> --Julie Zetterberg
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
Group: ICG-D Message: 609 From: randwhit@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
In a message dated 11/28/00 6:29:38 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
ecmami@hotmail.com writes:


At AussieCon the categories were Novice and Experienced.  I don't know if
that was just because of small numbers or because a non-costumer was MD.


That's the way we've been running things in Arizona as well. It's been quite
a while since we've had enough entries to justify dividing them three ways.
Keeping a special prize for the newbies makes more sense to me than breaking
out the masters from the journeymen.

Randall
Group: ICG-D Message: 610 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
No question - the one and only Star-con in Denver we ever attended...about
1988 or so:

1. Rules: Division system (sort of) was used, but Masters were not
eligible for ANY awards - "Being a Master is award enough" was the excuse
given.

2. Celebrity judges - DRUNK celebrity judges - with a strict number total
award system of first, second, third in each category, categories were
pre-defined. The pre-defined wasn't such a huge problem, as this was a
media con, so 99% of the costumes fell into one of them. And applause
meter for Best in Show, from the category winners. (BIS was Harry Mudd -
with slave girls - who actually did look like the actor.)

3. The Masquerade Director from Hell. A kindergarten teacher, not
remotely a costumer, who treated all the entrants like her students. "Get
in line, single file, be quiet. BE QUIET!! The next person that talks
gets fined a dollar!!" We ignored her. Also, "There is an X in the middle
of the stage. You must go to the X. If you don't go to the X I will come
out and move you to the X!" And she did. Never mind what choreography you
had.

4. Telling us they could play tapes, then bitching that they had to go
look for a boom box when we showed up with one.

5. Putting the masquerade on BEFORE the play, as the "opening
entertainment" for the play, with all the scenery, furniture, etc. on stage
for the play already - expecting us to work around it. Stephen and Marian
Clark were doing a presentation called "Good and Evil" which was an 'angel'
and a 'demon' fighting. They both had wings that sprang open at one
point. His hit the scenery and broke in the middle of the
presentation. (Those of you who were at CC8 might remember this costume.)

6. The MC from hell. Making crass comments about the costumes (thinking
to be funny) while the contestants were on stage, ad-libbing whatever came
into his empty little head instead of reading the script, etc. We were
part of a group of 6 or 7 doing Klingon (original series) hunting costumes
(extrapolations). There were 4 or 5 women and 2 men. He had to make dirty
jokes about the number of women vs. men, about "weapons", etc. He's very
lucky to have escaped with all parts intact, as we were all carrying steel.

7. The smarmy apologies afterwards, when they tried to give us an award -
we refused it, since they had told us ahead of time we weren't eligible for
one, and they were trying to make up for all the other things that
happened. We (the group) told them in no uncertain terms what they could
do with it.

Bad enough??

P & S
Group: ICG-D Message: 611 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Ah, yes. Celebrity judges. Writers deciding the fate of costumers. I took a
Most Humorous award at Chattacon once.But only after one judge explained my
presentation to the other four. I did a Ghostbusters/Ghost thing and only one
of the judges had seen the movies. Talk about underqualified for the job.
Jeff S.

Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:

> No question - the one and only Star-con in Denver we ever attended...about
> 1988 or so:
>
> 1. Rules: Division system (sort of) was used, but Masters were not
> eligible for ANY awards - "Being a Master is award enough" was the excuse
> given.
>
> 2. Celebrity judges - DRUNK celebrity judges - with a strict number total
> award system of first, second, third in each category, categories were
> pre-defined. The pre-defined wasn't such a huge problem, as this was a
> media con, so 99% of the costumes fell into one of them. And applause
> meter for Best in Show, from the category winners. (BIS was Harry Mudd -
> with slave girls - who actually did look like the actor.)
>
> 3. The Masquerade Director from Hell. A kindergarten teacher, not
> remotely a costumer, who treated all the entrants like her students. "Get
> in line, single file, be quiet. BE QUIET!! The next person that talks
> gets fined a dollar!!" We ignored her. Also, "There is an X in the middle
> of the stage. You must go to the X. If you don't go to the X I will come
> out and move you to the X!" And she did. Never mind what choreography you
> had.
>
> 4. Telling us they could play tapes, then bitching that they had to go
> look for a boom box when we showed up with one.
>
> 5. Putting the masquerade on BEFORE the play, as the "opening
> entertainment" for the play, with all the scenery, furniture, etc. on stage
> for the play already - expecting us to work around it. Stephen and Marian
> Clark were doing a presentation called "Good and Evil" which was an 'angel'
> and a 'demon' fighting. They both had wings that sprang open at one
> point. His hit the scenery and broke in the middle of the
> presentation. (Those of you who were at CC8 might remember this costume.)
>
> 6. The MC from hell. Making crass comments about the costumes (thinking
> to be funny) while the contestants were on stage, ad-libbing whatever came
> into his empty little head instead of reading the script, etc. We were
> part of a group of 6 or 7 doing Klingon (original series) hunting costumes
> (extrapolations). There were 4 or 5 women and 2 men. He had to make dirty
> jokes about the number of women vs. men, about "weapons", etc. He's very
> lucky to have escaped with all parts intact, as we were all carrying steel.
>
> 7. The smarmy apologies afterwards, when they tried to give us an award -
> we refused it, since they had told us ahead of time we weren't eligible for
> one, and they were trying to make up for all the other things that
> happened. We (the group) told them in no uncertain terms what they could
> do with it.
>
> Bad enough??
>
> P & S
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
Group: ICG-D Message: 612 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
I KNEW that had to be printed out somewhere! Thanks Betsy! It is now safely saved
on disk.

Hugs,
Susan

Betsy Delaney wrote:

> Oops! Didn't read this as closely the first time. It's the Guidelines
> for Competition, not the By-Laws, that discuss the competitions accepted
> as international level by the ICG.
>
> See http://www.costume.org/admin/guidelines.txt for more information on
> these Guidelines.
Group: ICG-D Message: 613 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
Whoo Hoo! Great Job! How did you get so many new people?

carowriter@yahoo.com wrote:

> After a 3-year hiatus, the masquerade returned to LosCon on Saturday,
> November 25. When the lights went down on a standing-room-only
> crowd, there were 28 entries to grace the stage, 14 of whom were
> novices.
Group: ICG-D Message: 614 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: locations
Dear Susan:

sFinally, one
>of my friends explained that she is almost impossible to get because she
>does not fly.

It's not quite that simple. To begin with Anne had no trouble flying;
but then she got an ear infection, and couldn't fly. That kept her tied up
for a couple of years, before it was totally cleared. Then her daughter
decied to get married, and there went another year. These days her health
is apparently not what it used to be, and she simply doesn't travel much.
This information courtesy of Elisabeth Pearce, a couple of years before her
(Elizabeth's) death.

Peace
Alixandra
eddana@hotmail.com
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Group: ICG-D Message: 615 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Award to the Pettingers!
Dear Lord! Pierre & Sandy, you two deserve a congressional metal of honor for
not killing the whole lot!

And I thought Jeff & I had a bad time at NolaCon! My heartfelt sympothies
actually do go out to Drew Sanders who caught Holy Hell over a lot of stuff that
really was NOT his fault at Nola, but someone had to be the scape goat.

Hugs,
Susan
Group: ICG-D Message: 616 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: 2004 Dates
> From my understanding, Dragoncon and Worldcon are going to be on the same
> weekend for at least the next five years, so going to both in 2004 will be a
> real neat trick anyway. (Not undoable, mind you, depending on when the
> respective Masquerades are scheduled at the respective conferences.)
> John Syms
> Exhibitions Division
> Head
> Millennium Philcon

I deleted my own ramblings. Did I mention that Charlotte 2004 is the last week
in August? It's the week before Dragon.

Hugs,
Susan
Group: ICG-D Message: 617 From: de Doc Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
>Whoo Hoo! Great Job! How did you get so many new people?
>
>carowriter@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>> After a 3-year hiatus, the masquerade returned to LosCon on Saturday,
>> November 25. When the lights went down on a standing-room-only
>> crowd, there were 28 entries to grace the stage, 14 of whom were
>> novices.

Local demand, for one thing. The concom felt that there weren't enough
interested folks out there to justify a Masquerade; they were informed of
the error of their ways politely, immediately, and frequently... <g>

Careful attention to adjustment of rules. Encouraging people to enter hall
costumes for formal Masquerade judging was, I think, a very fruitful step,
and deserves careful consideration in other areas where costuming seems to
be going flat. Further, making the ICG category of the entrant known to
the judges, but NOT announcing them to the audience, and deemphasizing
strict attention to in-class awards (while emphasizing "Best of..." or
"Best *at*..." awards in general), paradoxically took pressure OFF the less
experienced contestants. Since class and formal structuring wasn't so
heavily emphasized, but type of entrant was -- Original, Shared Universes,
Blast From The Past -- new folks concentrated on what they wanted to do,
rather than even thinking about being on the same stage with Masters. It
is counter-intuitive, I know, but it seemed to have that effect.

Encouragement and a fostering attitude, from the moment the Masque was
announced.

Aggressive arm-twisting by many of us who have done this before, and
deliberately planned trips explicitly to compete. ;-)

Carolyn deserves *major* props for her efforts, as do those who helped her
mount this pookah.

Hip hip, huzzah!

cheerily, de Doc
Group: ICG-D Message: 618 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Dear Sandy and Pierre:


>
>6. The MC from hell. Making crass comments about the costumes (thinking
>to be funny) while the contestants were on stage, ad-libbing whatever came
>into his empty little head instead of reading the script, etc.

Penny Lipman had to deal with someone like that at a media con, in
Chicago. I don't know whether, or not he was drunk, but he made rude
comments, and he did things behind the costumer's backs. Penny was wearing
a lovely gown, and this jerk was prancing around on the stage behind her, so
that everyone laughed. No one would say "Boo", because he was some media
big shot.

>
>7. The smarmy apologies afterwards, when they tried to give us an award -
>we refused it, since they had told us ahead of time we weren't eligible for
>one, and they were trying to make up for all the other things that
>happened. We (the group) told them in no uncertain terms what they could
>do with it.

I'm glad that someone had the guts to tell them off.

Peace
Alixandra
eddana@hotmail.com
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Group: ICG-D Message: 619 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Size isn't everything........
> >_____
>
>Yeah yeah yeah.................You women are always telling us size doesn't
>matter........
>
>
>;-)
>
>Daren
>
Daren, that's not what I said.

E
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Group: ICG-D Message: 620 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
>That's the way we've been running things in Arizona as well. It's been
>quite
>a while since we've had enough entries to justify dividing them three ways.
>Keeping a special prize for the newbies makes more sense to me than
>breaking
>out the masters from the journeymen.
>
>Randall


Thanks.
IMHO, it makes more sense to do it that way than to force the newbies to
compete with masters. Probably you'll build the ranks that way, and not
scare folks off.

Elaine
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Group: ICG-D Message: 621 From: Nebula5@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: FANAC Worldcon Photos
I love this site: http://www.fanac.org/worldcon/

They're collecting information, photos, and artifacts from past worldcons,
and posting them for all to see. I've provided a few photos myself, and
added some captions or corrections.

Here's the problem: Over the last year or so, I've written (very nicely)
several times to inform them that nearly all the masquerade photos shown as
"1983 ConStellation" are from "1993 ConFrancisco." Maybe if some of the
folks who are actually shown in these photos could specifically inform them
of the problem, they might take action.

Just bugs me...

--Julie Z.
Group: ICG-D Message: 622 From: Timothy Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Divisions/awards
>Thanks.
>IMHO, it makes more sense to do it that way than to force the newbies to
>compete with masters. Probably you'll build the ranks that way, and not
>scare folks off.
>
>Elaine

At MileHi Con this year, I took the emphasis off of divisions. Members of the committee felt that divisions were scary, and caused people not to enter. I couldn't get it through their heads that divisions were good because it let novices know that they were not competing against the masters. Instead I just put in the rules that each costume would be judged on it's own merits. We had 2 ICG master entries, the rest was local talent. We didn't have enough entries for BIC awards, so the judges just gave a BIS, then a selection of Best_________ awards to the entries they felt exhibited merit. I think it worked out well.

Bruno
Group: ICG-D Message: 623 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
Even though I've had numerous bad masquerade experiences--falling off the
back of the stasge at a Balticon long ago being merely one of them, my
absolute worst costume experience, like Julie's was with a costume that I
considered one of my very best efforts, AND it was a perfect recreation
of the book cover, and I did have the documentation to prove it. A color
photocopy, and for the parts of the costume not shown, I had the artist
(whom I wrote to) send me a set of color pencil drawings of what the
boots, etc. would have looked like. It was a recreation of
"Hawkmistress", from the Marion Zimmer Bradley Darkover series of books,
with a rather dramatic cover of a young girl holding out a trained hawk.
I even made the hawk, with wings that moved during the presentation by
use of a fake glove, with my hand up inside the bird. I was a novice and
it was my first really serious effort.

It won NOTHING at the Balticon I first showed it at (wait, maybe it got
honorable mention for workmanship), but NO presentation award. I heard
later through the grapevine (another one of the judges) that one of the
judges thought it "Wasn't glitzy enough" to win anything. I was furious,
esp. since many costumers I respected told me they thought it was very
unfair and that the costume was terrific. After all, costuming isn't
just about glitz. It actually turned me off for quite a while; made me
feel that unless you were a "name" costumer, you weren't going to win
anything, that the whole thing was run by people who were very snobby.

Fortunately enough people told me that they liked my work, that
eventually I was able to continue costuming. And many of my favorite
costumes have not won big awards, but have gotten a great reaction
anyway. I realize that judges panels aree sometimes unpredictable, but
one judge, no matter how persuasive, should be allowed to dominate the
panel. That's what the Masq. Director is for.

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
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Group: ICG-D Message: 624 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
> I heard
> later through the grapevine (another one of the judges) that one of the
> judges thought it "Wasn't glitzy enough" to win anything.

That's the thing that happened to Marty Gere (forgive my misspelling
his last name). He and his group did the King, Queen and faries from Disney's
Sleeping Beauty and tracked down ECAXTLY the right colors for each costume,
as well as duplicating all correct details, only to hear later that the
primary reason for not winning was, "Not glitzy enough". Here's a suggestion
on choosing future judges: Pick someone who watches a movie once in a
while...! Yeesh.

Jeff S.

>
>
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Group: ICG-D Message: 625 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
Although I don't have the long-standing experience of Pierre and many of
the respected costumers who have been with teh ICG since it's inception,
my feeling is that costume presentations from a CC should Definitely be
encouraged for Worldcons--first, because there won't be all that much
overlap between attending members (CC is relatively small compared with
even a good-sized regional con, let alone Worldcon), and second, because
fandom really needs to see the truly excellent costumes that we put on at
a CC. This can only give us greater credibility with the rest of the SF
world. And the Masq. truly is the high point of even a Worldcon, easily
equal to the Hugo ceremony.

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
Looking forward to the Millenium Philcon and may even have a costume for
it
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Group: ICG-D Message: 626 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
As far as getting prople at a local or regional con interested in
costuming and in being in the Masq.--Susan deG did a great job with
Lunacon in Rye, Ny in getting a Masq. off teh ground. She made hall
costumes into a big deal with a number of roaming judges and you brought
your ribbon to the prominently located Masq. Registration desk, where
they took a polaroid of you and displayed it in the hall outside the main
ballroom. Then, you got a hand- calligraphy lovely little certificate
with teh costume name written on it as well. In addition, she got many
of us to work up costume-related panels, including the all day Saturday
"Costume in a Day" (sort of $1.98 competition) and put people on stage,
integrated into the MAsq., but eligible for regular awards and for a
special "made today" category. People who wanted to enter were also
offered an opportunity for a tech rehearsal.

It really went over well, and in general, the Lunacon Masq. has
prospered.

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
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Group: ICG-D Message: 627 From: Alix Jordan Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Dear Jeff:

> Ah, yes. Celebrity judges. Writers deciding the fate of costumers.

This can work. Authors like Tanya Huff, Emma Bull, Patrica Wrede,
Julian May, and others have been costumers, and know what to look for.
Others, like Terry Pratchett, are very good; because they know and
understand costumes; and have an open mind. Others, however...
Let's put it this way. I've lost two major awards, in Toronto, because a
non-costumer judge decided that they didn't like the costume, and threatened
to freeze the rest of the judging, if the other judges, who liked my
costume, didn't go along with it. Unfortunately, none of the others had the
guts to toss the trouble maker out, because this person was "somebody".
Another problem with the non-costumer judges seems to be the tendency to
award to funny presentation, in street clothes, over good presentations, in
costume.


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Group: ICG-D Message: 628 From: J.A. Kelley Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Chicago TARDIS Masqerade Show Results
Chicago TARDIS, a *Doctor Who* convention held Thanksgiving Weekend in
Chicagoland, USA, held a Masquerade Show on Saturday, November 25th. The
Chicagoland Costumers' Guild helped with the competition.

A "Masquerade Show" is a little different from a traditional masquerade, in
that entrants are allowed to compete in the categories of "musical
performance" and "dramatic performance" as well as the traditional
novice/journeyman/master.

Masquerade Director: Jennifer Adams Kelley (secretary, Chicagoland
Costumers' Guild)

Masquerade Assistant: Barbara Wright (treasurer, Chicagoland Costumers' Guild)

Judges:
Carol Mitchell (president, Chicagoland Costumers' Guild and Co-Chair,
Costume-Con 21)
Robert Warnock (founding member, The Federation, a fan video group)

Awards:

BEST CROSSDRESSER:
Jay Leslie, 1920's Flapper

BEST DOCTOR:
Al Achtner, Third Doctor

BEST WORKMANSHIP:
Paulette Imhoff, Traditional Klingon Wedding Dress

BEST COMPANION:
Peter Himsoth, The Highlander (no, not Connor and not Duncan, the OTHER
Highlander)

BEST COMIC COMPANION
Robert A. Wetendorf, Batman

BEST IN CLASS, NOVICE
Zoe McAden and Jeremy Bement, Zoe and Jamie

BEST IN CLASS, JOURNEYMAN
Mark, Cathleen, and Caitlin Christensen, OZ

BEST IN CLASS, DRAMATIC
Dennis Kuhn, Medieval Doctor Who

JUDGES' CHOICE
Hal Bierman and Tricia Overkamp, Pledge Break

BEST IN SHOW
Michael Palmer, Davros

Congratulations to all our winners!!!!

--Jennifer
Group: ICG-D Message: 629 From: corwyn@kolvir.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: A possibly random thought ...
with more work implications for our webmaster...

Are the masquerade results that people post to the list archived in a
separate location anywhere?
Group: ICG-D Message: 630 From: Timothy Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
> That's the thing that happened to Marty Gere (forgive my misspelling
>his last name). He and his group did the King, Queen and faries from Disney's
>Sleeping Beauty and tracked down ECAXTLY the right colors for each costume,
>as well as duplicating all correct details, only to hear later that the
>primary reason for not winning was, "Not glitzy enough". Here's a suggestion
>on choosing future judges: Pick someone who watches a movie once in a
>while...! Yeesh.

Gee, I wonder if that's the "Sleeping Beauty" entry from legend that I've heard about. I've heard the tale of a dead on "Sleeping Beauty" entry that was seriously slammed by one of the judges; wings too small on fairies, hideous colors, etc, etc. It turned out that the judge had never seen the movie and didn't understand the entry.

Bruno
Group: ICG-D Message: 631 From: JBdashoff@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Multi Use Costume Question
In a message dated 11/27/2000 8:35:45 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Stringer@cdc.net writes:

> If Atlanta wins CostumeCon, I need to
> know if I can use the same costume for myself that I will use at DragonCon.
> BTW - DragonCon is NOT an ICG sanctioned show, but it IS larger than
> WorldCon with attendance of 20,000 fans and 30-50 entries in the
> Masquerade. Guys & gals, Dragon is HUGE! (See www.DragonCon.org - D*C
> History for information.) What I'm getting at is this: If it's ok to use
a
> costume at WorldCon that has been seen/shown/award winning at "smaller"
> conventions, what about DragonCon Winners?
And Dragoncon 2001 is the same weekend as the 59th Worldcon aka the
Millennium Philcon, to be held in Philadelphia, PA in August, 2001.
The Millennium Philcon will be the administrator of the election for the
site of the Worldcon in 2004. Currently there are proposals from two cities,
Charlotte and Boston, to host this event.
Susan, if you are serious in your campaign for Charlotte in 2004, you may
wish to change your personal plans.
Please register any complaints about the timing of Dragoncon with the
Dragoncon people; it was their choice to change weekends.
Information on the Millennium Philcon is available at
www.netaxs.com/~phil2001 or at (departmentname)@ milphil.org
Sincerely,
Joni Brill Dashoff, Treasurer, 59th Worldcon
aka Bovita Peron, just one of Sandy's herd
member, Lunatyk Phrynge
Group: ICG-D Message: 632 From: randwhit@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
In a message dated 11/29/00 5:00:16 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
eddana@hotmail.com writes:

This can work.  Authors like Tanya Huff, Emma Bull, Patrica Wrede,
Julian May, and others have been costumers, and know what to look for.  


Cool!  We'll have Julian May as GOH at Coppercon this fall.

Randall
SWCG
Coppercon 21 Masquerade Director
Group: ICG-D Message: 633 From: randwhit@aol.com Date: 11/29/2000
Subject: Re: Chicago TARDIS Masqerade Show Results
I've had an idea about costuming as The Doctor's yodeling grandmother.

"Little Old Lady Who"

I'll probably never do it.

Randall
Group: ICG-D Message: 634 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Celebrity judges - actors, not writers. George Takei among them. It WAS
funny seeing his face when two little Asian girls (about 6 or so) came on
stage as "Sulu's children".

Sandy

P.S. Some writers are excellent judges. If you win the Worldcon bid, I'm
sure several of us on this list will be amenable to offering suggestions.

> Ah, yes. Celebrity judges. Writers deciding the fate of costumers. I took a
>Most Humorous award at Chattacon once.But only after one judge explained my
>presentation to the other four. I did a Ghostbusters/Ghost thing and only one
>of the judges had seen the movies. Talk about underqualified for the job.
>Jeff S.
Group: ICG-D Message: 635 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: FANAC Worldcon Photos
>Here's the problem: Over the last year or so, I've written (very nicely)
>several times to inform them that nearly all the masquerade photos shown as
>"1983 ConStellation" are from "1993 ConFrancisco." Maybe if some of the
>folks who are actually shown in these photos could specifically inform them
>of the problem, they might take action.

Don't bet on it - we told them also.

P & S
Group: ICG-D Message: 636 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
Actually, it was one usually very competent judge with a strong
personality, who had NEVER seen the movie, and thought the colors were too
garish and clashed. The other judges for the class (there were separate
judging panels for each class) were not as experienced and deferred to this
person's experience. The documentation apparently never made it to the
judges. To give the judge credit, when the judge finally saw the
documentation afterward, he/she felt very bad about them not getting an
award, as the costumes were dead on correct.

Notice being very careful not to give away privileged information.

P & S

> That's the thing that happened to Marty Gere (forgive my misspelling
>his last name). He and his group did the King, Queen and faries from Disney's
>Sleeping Beauty and tracked down ECAXTLY the right colors for each costume,
>as well as duplicating all correct details, only to hear later that the
>primary reason for not winning was, "Not glitzy enough". Here's a suggestion
>on choosing future judges: Pick someone who watches a movie once in a
>while...! Yeesh.
>
>Jeff S.
Group: ICG-D Message: 637 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Coppercon
Ask if she'll bring something to display, if you can scare up a dress form or mannequin.  You can stick it in a corner of the art show for security.  That's what Archon does for their costuming GOH's.  Her stuff is AWESOME!!

P & S

Cool!  We'll have Julian May as GOH at Coppercon this fall.

Randall
SWCG
Coppercon 21 Masquerade Director
Group: ICG-D Message: 638 From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Well, as long as we're naming names:
Poul Anderson (married to one costumer, father of another)
Greg Bear (husband of above named daughter)
Larry Niven
Barbara Hambly
Robert Sawyer
David Cherry
Kelly Freas
Laura Brodian Freas
Michael Whelan
Don Maitz
Janny Wurts

This is just a few.

P & S

> This can work. Authors like Tanya Huff, Emma Bull, Patrica Wrede,
>Julian May, and others have been costumers, and know what to look for.
>Others, like Terry Pratchett, are very good; because they know and
>understand costumes; and have an open mind.
Group: ICG-D Message: 639 From: Timothy Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Starcon Costume Contest
>No question - the one and only Star-con in Denver we ever attended...about
>1988 or so:
>

P & S,

Since I've been living in the Denver area, I've heard nothing but bad things about the Starcon costume contest. We have several guild members that absolutely refuse to attend another Starcon. I've been to 4 Starcon's and entered twice. While not ideal conditions, they're comparable to what I had while living in TX. The guild has started to use Starcon as a recruiting source. We host a club table and costume display at each con. We only gleamed one new member so far, but we seem to be well received and people like seeing the costumes on display. We also made connections with local media costumers, who are unhappy with the Starcon system. The guild refrains from commenting on things publicly as we would be seen as the elitist costumers who want everything their way. We do however try to urge non-guild members to express their concerns to the staff.

I will comment on your experiences, then address the Starcon rules later.

>1. Rules: Division system (sort of) was used, but Masters were not
>eligible for ANY awards - "Being a Master is award enough" was the excuse
>given.
>

They no longer have skill divisions, but Master is a category of it's own, defined as those having placed in three Starcons.

>2. Celebrity judges - DRUNK celebrity judges - with a strict number total
>award system of first, second, third in each category, categories were
>pre-defined. The pre-defined wasn't such a huge problem, as this was a
>media con, so 99% of the costumes fell into one of them. And applause
>meter for Best in Show, from the category winners. (BIS was Harry Mudd -
>with slave girls - who actually did look like the actor.)
>

I've never actually seen the judges, they're not introduced, but I'm sure they use the celebs. At the con last April, none of the judges showed up and they picked people out of the audience to judge (they did make a few good decisions). Last September (99), BIS went to the "Orion Slave Traders". A couple in their ren-faire outfits (I saw them there), and several girls in bikinis. I think they gave out about 9 memberships just for that entry. I have never seen the applause meter used at Starcon. I was used alot in TX, especially at Creation Cons.

>3. The Masquerade Director from Hell. A kindergarten teacher, not
>remotely a costumer, who treated all the entrants like her students. "Get
>in line, single file, be quiet. BE QUIET!! The next person that talks
>gets fined a dollar!!" We ignored her. Also, "There is an X in the middle
>of the stage. You must go to the X. If you don't go to the X I will come
>out and move you to the X!" And she did. Never mind what choreography you
>had.
>

Yes, the MD can be a B****. Haven't seen anything that bad yet. They also do not require that you stand on the "X". Don't think I've heard about it. They have brought children back out and placed them in the center of the stage after they left too quickly to see the costume.

>4. Telling us they could play tapes, then bitching that they had to go
>look for a boom box when we showed up with one.
>
They now have a large sound set up. They can play tapes and CDs. They don't always work as I experienced last April, but they do have the ability. Not much lighting except up and down, but with no tech, I barely trust them to get the sound right let alone lights.

>5. Putting the masquerade on BEFORE the play, as the "opening
>entertainment" for the play, with all the scenery, furniture, etc. on stage
>for the play already - expecting us to work around it.

The Play is now the intro to the costume contest. Although it makes the wait in the green room really long. You also miss the play, unless they hook-up a TV. The plays that I have seen have been extremely funny.

>6. The MC from hell. Making crass comments about the costumes (thinking
>to be funny) while the contestants were on stage, ad-libbing whatever came
>into his empty little head instead of reading the script, etc.

Kevin hasn't changed a bit. As unprofessional today as he was in 1988. Last con, a child klingon was heckled from the audience and ran from the stage.

The biggest problem with Starcon is the stage. One entrance stage right. The stage is lined with drapes on all sides. There is no stage past the curtain, so when you exit you have to go through the drape and immediately down the rickety stairs in near darkness. I remember once, a group left the stage in masks. They all went through the curtain as a group and one of them missed the stairs and walked off the stage, nearly took the drape down with them.

Following are the Starcon rules from this past April. I don't know if they changed in September or not. I've also interjected my comments in brackets.

Bruno

Starcon Costume Contest rules.

There is a limit of 75 entries.

1. All costumes must be original. If you bought or rented your costume as one unit (i.e. a Batman costume as opposed to purchasing your tights here, your cape there, and yor leotard somewhere else and customizing it to fit your character) points cannot be given for anything except presentation. [I'm sure this one has been broken. They also don't take into account if you paid someone to make your entire recreation costume for you. The seamstress gets no credit.]

2. All winning costumes must be retired. They may be scavenged for parts, but refurbished doesn't constitute a new costume. [Definately been broken. I.E. Mulder & Scully in suits Best Media one con, same Mulder & Scully in suits w/trenchcoats placed in Media next con. Robot guy BIS one con, Robot guy with more pieces and different color Best Media next con]

3. Dramatic presentations, speeches, and skits must be kept to 30 seconds without prior permission. In fact a good rule of thumb would be to figure on 30 seconds per person on stage at the same time (although we would like to keep the upper limit to 3 minutes). There are exceptions to every rule, don't assume yours won't be allowed-ask-we are on your side.
A. If you wish to use a cassette tape with your presentation, you must make sure we know about it when you register and we would like to take possession of it then. The tape must be cued. (This means when you put the tape into the cassette player it will start immediately).
B. You must let us know if you are going to use any props and/or special effects. Figure if you can't carry it on stage with you; it probably won't be allowed. If there is any question about what can and can't be done you need to ask about it before the convention. We wouldn't want you to invest in equipment you can't use.

4. We strongly urge you to have a costume that is somewhat comfortable to wear. [etc, pretty standard]

5. No Nudity! [etc, etc, pretty standard]

6. There will be a winner and runner up selected from each category, and BIS. The categories for this convention's costume contest are:
A. Media/Science Fiction - costumes inspired by TV, movies, live or animated.
B. Fantasy/Literary - costumes inspired by Scifi/fantasy book or character (also Original characters)
C. Masters - for costumers having placed in three Starcons [I'm sure this one's been broken]
D. Juniors - for young costumers between 12-16 years of age [doesn't matter parent or jr made]
E. Children - for young costumers 12 and under [doesn't matter parent or child made]

All categories are subject to cancellation if there are less than 4 contestants and will be combined with the next best suitable category. There are some costumes that are qualified for more then one category. Effort will be made to put them in the most appropriate category. [I've seen them run Fantasy w/3 entries. I've also seen them group Media/SF & Fantasy into one category and break out Star Trek into it's own category. There were like 32 Star Trek entries at that con.]

End Starcon Costume Contest Rules
Group: ICG-D Message: 640 From: Jeff & Susan Stringer Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Rennesaince Costumes
Oh Yes! I think I promised to do this about a dozen times & I FINALLY
brought home a disk with the information on it.

For the shop, I made a BUNCH of costumes using the current patterns from
Simplicity & McCalls (with some alterations) in Junior, Standard, Plus &
Texas Small sizes for rental. They have been VERY popular for
Halloween, School plays & even some conventions. My school drama people
just go nuts when they figure out that they can use the under dress with
vests or aprons for the "street scenes" and then add the over dresses
for the ballroom scenes. Same thing with the guys, shirts and tights
for common, add the over vests for fancy. NO costume changes backstage
with dozens of teenagers. BOY did the School for Performing arts like
THAT idea, not to mention it cut their costume costs in half using two
looks for one costume! Whoo Hoo!

Fabrics are: Cotton batiste from Walmart $1.88 yard, Panne` Velvets
from Foust prox $3.50 yard, Brocades from Foust - "RAGS" at $1.00 per
Pound, Course cotton lace trims from Fabric Warehouse, Chattanooga $50
per box of 100 yards, Metallic trims from National Braid, wide stuff
came in an assortment of 250 yards for 75 cents per yard.

Hugs,
Susan

http://www.cdc.net/~stringer/RomanceA.html
http://www.cdc.net/~stringer/RomanceB.html
http://www.cdc.net/~stringer/RomanceC.html - most of these I didn't put
up the pics yet because they wouldn't fit on the floppy disk. But they
weren't the fun ones for school plays anyway.
Group: ICG-D Message: 641 From: Betsy Delaney Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Add to this list CJ Cherryh. I've judged with her several times, and she
is always fair.

-betsy

Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:
>
> Well, as long as we're naming names:
> Poul Anderson (married to one costumer, father of another)
> Greg Bear (husband of above named daughter)
> Larry Niven
> Barbara Hambly
> Robert Sawyer
> David Cherry
> Kelly Freas
> Laura Brodian Freas
> Michael Whelan
> Don Maitz
> Janny Wurts
>
> This is just a few.
>
> P & S

--
Betsy R. Delaney
Web Mistress at large
WebInvent.com, Inc.

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Group: ICG-D Message: 642 From: carowriter@yahoo.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
Three of our four judges at Loscon were artists -- Kelly Freas, Laura
Bodian Freas, and Sue Dawe. All were excellent, and I'd be happy to
have them judge again.

In addition, Loscon's Artist GOH Bob Eggleton was the masquerade MC,
and it worked out terrifically. He has a tremendous respect for the
costumes and the people who do them, so he also might be someone that
would be good to tap for judging.

A side benefit of asking the artist GOH to be the MC and having Kelly
Freas (who was being honored by Loscon, even if not a GOH) was that
when one of the chairs suggested that I have one of the con's other
special guests whom I did *not* want, it gave me a tremendous amount
of leverage to say "no."

Carolyn Louaillier
carowriter@yahoo.com
Group: ICG-D Message: 643 From: carowriter@yahoo.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
--- In ICG-D@egroups.com, Jeff & Susan Stringer <Stringer@c...> wrote:
>
> Whoo Hoo! Great Job! How did you get so many new people?

A lot of begging and groveling. <g> Seriously, we put the word out
as much as possible (although we did get the usual "I wish I'd
known"). Also, two of our hall costume judges were actively
recruiting people to come over and sign up.

I brought music and helped contestants pick something to back up
their presentations. I talked to some of them about their
character's motivation, how they should move. I *wrote* one of the
presentations (a committee member who stepped forward into the breach
when we were worrying about how many people we would have). We just
played it as loose as we possibly could for the newbies, with a focus
on having a good show.

Some of the things we allowed that aren't "standard":

We allowed, even encouraged, past winners to bring their stuff and
show up. That's where the "Blast from the Past" category comes in --
the judges know its a winning costume, and such costumes are
competing against each other, not everyone else. It managed to
garner us at least one really nice piece from the 1988 Westercon
which added tremendously to the show.

Hall costumes were allowed to, even encouraged, to enter. That
accounted for a number of our entries and worked out very well. This
formed the bulk of the novices that were up on stage.

You did not have to be a member of the convention to compete. It was
finally decided that they don't actually lose any money with this
rule, because if the costumers show up Saturday evening to compete,
and wouldn't show up otherwise, the con gains by an improved
masquerade. My only requisite was that if you weren't coming to the
con and wanted to enter, you had to let me know ahead of time. There
were at least two groups where some of their members were not members
of the committee.

We did not announce skill division to the audience. I've seen
audience members dismiss a costume when they hear the word "novice"
before they've seen a thing, and complain afterwards there weren't
enough masters. Instead, it was announced at the beginning that half
the entries were novices, and emphasized that this was a good thing.
The audience was very receptive and ready to enjoy the show, which
helped.

Everyone seemed to have a good time, which is the main thing I wanted
to achieve, and it looks like we're on for next year.

Carolyn Louaillier
carowriter@yahoo.com
Group: ICG-D Message: 644 From: carowriter@yahoo.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: LosCon 27 Masquerade Results
--- In ICG-D@egroups.com, de Doc <billerno@w...> wrote:

> Local demand, for one thing. The concom felt that there weren't
enough
> interested folks out there to justify a Masquerade; they were
informed of
> the error of their ways politely, immediately, and frequently...

And a thank you to those who did. Ironically, the three years the
masquerade was gone were three years I didn't participate in Loscon
much. (My wedding, a friend's wedding, and sitting a fan table,
which kinda locked me in one place.)

It
> is counter-intuitive, I know, but it seemed to have that effect.

Part of my decisions were based on the fact that I don't usually
enter masquerades -- I'm in the audience. I tried to think of how I
could balance what the entrants need with what would be most
entertaining to the audience, while dealing with certain non-
masquerade deadlines (the annual 6 PM Art Show hover to get in final
bids, which at least one of our contestants was attending).

> Aggressive arm-twisting by many of us who have done this before, and
> deliberately planned trips explicitly to compete. ;-)

For which I am enternally grateful. <g>

> Carolyn deserves *major* props for her efforts, as do those who
helped her
> mount this pookah.

Okay, now I'm blushing. I agreed to do it because I was convinced
there was a group out there who wanted to compete -- we just had to
figure out how to encourage them. I was also blessed with good tech
people and crew, all of whom are long-time Loscon members. I
couldn't have done it myself, and my thanks goes out to everyone who
participated.

Someone asked me how I could top this next year. My response was
that *I* couldn't -- we had to encourage the entrants to do so.

Carolyn Louaillier
carowriter@yahoo.com
Group: ICG-D Message: 645 From: Timothy Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
I used Horror writer P.D. Cacek at MileHi con. She was great.

Bruno

>Add to this list CJ Cherryh. I've judged with her several times, and she
>is always fair.
>
>-betsy
>
>Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:
>>
>> Well, as long as we're naming names:
>> Poul Anderson (married to one costumer, father of another)
>> Greg Bear (husband of above named daughter)
>> Larry Niven
>> Barbara Hambly
>> Robert Sawyer
>> David Cherry
>> Kelly Freas
>> Laura Brodian Freas
>> Michael Whelan
>> Don Maitz
>> Janny Wurts
>>
>> This is just a few.
>>
>> P & S
>
>--
>Betsy R. Delaney
>Web Mistress at large
>WebInvent.com, Inc.
>
>************************************************************************
>mailto:WebInvent@WebInvent.com or visit http://www.WebInvent.com/
>mailto:Costume-Con@Costume-Con.org or visit http://www.Costume-Con.org/
>mailto:betsy@hawkeswood.com or visit http://www.hawkeswood.com/
>************************************************************************
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>ICG-D-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>
Group: ICG-D Message: 646 From: Linda Peterson Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Good writer (and artist) judges
I worked with the Artist GOH year before last at MileHiCon who was
clear,concise, organized and understood the field. What was his name,
Bruno? Linda

On Thu, 30 Nov 2000, Timothy wrote:

> I used Horror writer P.D. Cacek at MileHi con. She was great.
>
> Bruno

mirhaxa@morktorn.com
Group: ICG-D Message: 647 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
REgarding Pierre and Sandy's comment about documentation "never having
gotten to the judges"

In general, I've noticed a problem with getting documentation to judges
for these types of costumes--it is handed in to the Masq. registration
desk along with the tape, and then what happens to it? Figuring that in
any given masq. there are probably no more than a few recreations, why
has this traditionally been such a problem ?

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
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Group: ICG-D Message: 648 From: lisa58@juno.com Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
Regarding your comment about "picking a judge that watches a movie once
in a while". Actually, the way it's always been presentted to me was
that you ALWAYS need to have decent documentation for any sort of
recreation, media, book cover, or otherwise, because you can count on
having a judge that hasn't ever seen any particular movie. And that's
true. But I don't think that costumers who try recreations have EVER
been given enough credit when they achieve a good or perfect likeness. I
am positive, knowing Marty Gear for almost 10 years, that he and his
partners had absolute documentation of their costumes and why they chose
their fabrics. But that doesn't help, when you have one or more judges
that insist that glitz is the only logical outcome of costuming.

Although I have never re-created any animation, I have been both a
workmanship and a presentation judge. If I KNOW that it's supposed to be
animation, then obviously I'll use different parameters than if it were a
live-action recreation. The key here is the documentation (usually
visual). When I participate on panels about recreation costumes, I
generally tell people that they had better be seriously motivated,
because their recreation costume, no matter how wonderful, is rarely
going to get the praise and attention that it deserves. My only personal
exception to this was doing the goddess Isis a few years ago, a
recreation from a statuette in the Smithsonian catalog. In point of
fact, Isis will be winner, because she's glitzy (all gold), has
impressive wings, and I had a neat lighting effect in the dark. Nobody
cared that it was a recreation except for me.

I have found, as I explored new avenues and becamse more sopisticated in
my technique, that achieving wonderful things with understated glitz, or
by means of textures, is more of a challenge. Sequins have their place,
but it's definitely true that sometimes less is more. I definitely use
fewer sequins now, more complex beadwork, more textural variations,
greater use of the "profile" of a costume for recognition.

Yours in costuming, Lisa A.
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Group: ICG-D Message: 649 From: Carol Mitchell Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: Digest Number 62
Erin McKee, who works the local RennFaire and is a
longtime fan, is frequently an artist guest of honor
and is usually great at judging masquerades.
Carol

=====
Carol Mitchell President Chicagoland Costumer's Guild
Manager Costume Programming Track Chicon 2000
Co-chair CostumeCon 21

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Group: ICG-D Message: 650 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade - was Multi Use Costume Question
I realize that judges panels aree sometimes unpredictable, but
>one judge, no matter how persuasive, should not be allowed to dominate the
>panel. That's what the Masq. Director is for.
>
>Yours in costuming, Lisa A.


I remember a CC (6 or 8?) in Calif. where Ricky Dick had an absolutely
drop-dead authentic Civil War recreation, with copious documentation, and
got nothing because a self-styled "expert" said that his boots were dusty
(he was in a WAR, after all, and riding horses) and what he was wearing was
not standard CSA issue! The CW reenactors in the group were appalled,
because practically nobody got to wear "standard issue" since there was a
serious supply problem - being wartime, but what could you do? She had read
a book or two, and was therefore an expert.

E
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Group: ICG-D Message: 651 From: Elaine Mami Date: 11/30/2000
Subject: Re: My Worst Masquerade
> Another problem with the non-costumer judges seems to be the tendency
>to
>award to funny presentation, in street clothes, over good presentations, in
>costume.
>


And how about their tendency to "forget" to come back from dinner with their
editors or whomever.

E
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